The Universe - is it Created? or by Chance?

[necrotic freak]

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... toink... mag lalis man noon...

kung unsay feel ninyo mao nlng..

kung anong pinaniniwalaan nyo... stick with it.. ok?

unya dili man mahimotang ang mga atheist kung naay motuo ug ginoo.

[schmuck]

@robert - Uncaused cause lagi na bro.
Mao na ilang Alpha-Omega. The beginning and the end. It existed in eternity. =)

Now, from your latest reply (gi-career na jud neh nato da. hehehe).

1. There are completely natural explanations presented on how non organic chemicals can form organic materials. Look up Abiogenesis. ( for the so called "Life points to life")
Sorry, all theories and hypotheses are subject to criticisms and mostly refuted.
That is why, a secular website, were still inviting researchers to give valid, irrefutable theory on how the first living cell could arise from a young planet earth.
So, what hypothesis you might be supporting? the Primordial soup? Sorry, this is already rejected.
Wiley::New Research Rejects 80-year Theory of ‘Primordial Soup’ as the Origin of Life
What's next?
(Chance?)

see hitch's reply for this.

Evolution explains how complex and intelligent creatures can evolve from simpler organisms( "This is for the so called "intelligence points to intelligence"). No intelligent beings required.
I don't know why you keep coming back to this. Balik-balik, tuyok-tuyok.
Evolution explains how complex creatures evolve from simpler organism.
Take note it does NOT explain why an irrational creature (from an ape-like form) became self-conscious being with freewill. Alangan man sad ni-kalit lang ug ka-sipok ang utok atong unggoya, nimata lang ug kalit, ug ni-ingon: "Waaahhh, I'm a monkey!!".
Yes, we could have the same "ancestral genetic root" as of apes. Besides, all living creatures could came from that single-celled animal 3.7 billion years ago. But as new evidences arise, it is found out that humans and monkeys lineage was split.

That was the turning point. Chimps continue with their animal instinct, homonids have freewill.
Was it adaptation? Please remember this is not just a race for survival like monkeys learning new skills, or a cheeta's speed, it's about being self-conscious, having a freewill, and NOT dictated to a mere animal instinct.
What hypothesis you might be supporting on this?
(Another Chance?)

You are making an assumption that self-consciousness and "freewill" can not be attained from an evolutionary process. When in fact it has already been extensively explained how a hominid which evolved a large enough brain will attain high levels of intelligence as a consequence.

And again you are implying that the self consciousness was attained in an instant. No, it would have been a gradual process of evolving increasing intelligence. Not instantaneously like "woah! Im human". IT would be so gradual, an organism would not know when the exact point it attained it. See my ladder analogy in the previous post. Another more clearer analogy, can you recall the earliest time in your childhood when you exaclty started remembering? No, you can't.

I am really starting to doubt whether you really have a good grasp of how evolution works.

btw, "freewill" is not limited to humans. Since freewill essentially means having choice and being able to make that choice of ones own accord. Animals have choice, they can choose who to mate with, when to sleep, which fruit to eat, or whether to kill you or not.

"matter and energy exists outside space and time?" I never said this LOL!

1. Bingo!
2. Bingo!
This was what I was saying many posts ago. And you finally get it! Congratulations!
Notice that my position does not cross into the supernatural realm. I don't invoke a "god", I stop at the universe(something that we know exists because we are in it and talking about about it now).


So, you're now negating the claims that you've made?
Like I've said, if you stop at the Universe, you will arrive in contradictions, like infinite past of things.

There is no contradiction. As I said, time and space was created when the singularity expanded. What does that mean? The singularity existed outside of space and time. Ka simple.

The fact is, our reality is made up of hyperdimensional space. What ever exists outside of the 3 dimensional universe we perceive, what that looks like, even what that is, I can't imagine it. Our brains are tuned to 3 dimensions only.
Well, we can't imagine a supernatural world. How's that?
Extra dimension as predicted by String Theory is still within our space-time dimension.
Beyond IT is NOT just unimaginable, but also unprovable.

Read up more on String Theory. There are dimensions within 3 dimensional space, it also describes hyperdimensional space(outside our own space)


btw, you havent answered my question, do you still believe the universe is "finely-tuned" for life?
And your position on the extraterrestrial version Jesus.

[robert_papalid_ece]

i believe that some animals have brains bigger than that of humans... sperm whales according to Wiki have the largest... and in terms of brain-to-body ratio... squirrels have a better number...

so it isn't just our physical brain that gave us that edge... as i've said... humans are blessed... we should be proud of that...

Animals have choice, they can choose who to mate with, when to sleep, which fruit to eat, or whether to kill you or not.

no biggie... of course they can... compare it to ours... that's the point... layoa jud tawn kaayo...

[schmuck]

i believe that some animals have brains bigger than that of humans... sperm whales according to Wiki have the largest... and in terms of brain-to-body ratio... squirrels have a better number...

so it isn't just our physical brain that gave us that edge... as i've said... humans are blessed... we should be proud of that...



no biggie... of course they can... compare it to ours... that's the point... layoa jud tawn kaayo...

If you agree that animals have freewill, do they sin? Why or why not?
Remember, "sin" is the misuse of freewill.

[kenites]

unya dili man mahimotang ang mga atheist kung naay motuo ug ginoo.

OT:
Grabeh pud...
nganong dili gud tawn

[robert_papalid_ece]

If you agree that animals have freewill, do they sin? Why or why not?
Remember, "sin" is the misuse of freewill.

nope... a better definition of the word "sin" is the transgression/violation of the law (religious, kung naa kay religion; and moral kung wala; government law sad...)... and i believe wala pa man tingale ko'y nadunggan nga naay balaod ang mga hulmigas, unggoy, isda...

by the way... this is an OT...

[necrotic freak]

OT:
Grabeh pud...
nganong dili gud tawn

suma gud unsa may inyong gibuhat diri sa forum? doing whatever it takes to disprove God.. and start labeling theists as ignorant..

[robert_papalid_ece]

suma gud unsa may inyong gibuhat diri sa forum? doing whatever it takes to disprove God.. and start labeling theists as ignorant..

awts... hinay2x lang gud pareng necro... basin kontrahan na sad ka pre...

[necrotic freak]

^^hinay ra na pre oi.. ignorante baya ko. hehe

[robert_papalid_ece]

^ ako pre... ignorante man sad ko... bahala na'g ignorante... bahala na'g tawgon ko nilang bogo... basta naa lang juy Ginoo...