Blessed Pedro Calungsod

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Kinsa diri mga brad naay nobena-latest version for Saint Pedro Calungsod.
Pwede pa share poh, salamat in advance...

Pm lang pls....thanks again.

[defender_1611]

heathen bai is something non-christian, non-jewish..could be pagan...unconverted or generally uncivilized

basta para nako...ang cross resembles Christ death on the cross for our sins.
i have already explained numerous times why i no longer consider the cross as shameful or is of heathen..
and that how we look at the cross would be its definition.
for mathematicians who doesnt believe in Jesus, a cross is just a plus sign...nothing more.
depende ra nas tao bai..laktud pagka storya.
kung muingun ka nga ang cross kay pagan...then imu nang pagsabut. wa tay mahems ana.

as far as the catholic encyclopedia states...it was about the history of the cross..letting people know all side of the story...kung naa kay lain nga interpretasyon...imuha pud na..pero wa na nagpasabut nga mao jud nay pasabut..
prehas sa imung giingun sa una nga from a catholic book jud nga Jesus is not enough.
ngutana ko nimu balik run, did that book really stated there that for Catholics, Jesus is not enough?
or imu ra pud tong interpretation...

karun mutuo ka nga nga once heathen, always a heathen? so way pulos ang sakripisyo ni Jesus
kay ang atong past, we are considered as bound for damnation...kung di pa diay pwede usbon ang past
why would Jesus rescued us? from damned to saved...
why would Christians preach the good news if ang past man diay atong pakadak.an?
might as well preach to the new born babies kadtong wala pa kahibaw unsay sala...
kay kung adto kas makasasala mu preach...way gamit...kay once makasasala, always a makasasala diba?
once a heathen symbol? always a heathen symbol?

mutuo ka nga through Christ's death on the cross we are redeemed?
if so, do you think his death on the cross was honorable?
using the logic you are imposing with this discussion bai...the answer would be No
kay dying on the cross is a shameful death..therefore, Christ death on the cross would also be shameful.

how can we be Christians if we do not honor Christ death on the cross which paved our way to salvation?
and if we do not honor His death, how can we claim His salvation?

@noy: you didnt get my point bay noy...what i mean is atong sabton na ang root or ang origin sa cross symbol is heathen? im not saying bay noy na heathen is always a heathen. ang punto nako bay noy bah na ang root or origin sa cross is heathen symbol.

[noy]

If based sa tradition sa inyung church, di nko mu question ana kay inyuha na wa tay common ground ana. Pero if you can answer my post with Bible verse, padayun ko

supporting verses ra sio just like our belief in the Trinity.

[noy]

OKay, so do you believe that the teachings in the Bible since perfect man, naa say Common sense?

yes bai, i believe that the bible is perfect. are you asking me if dapat ba sad apilan ug common sense ang pagbasa ug sabut sa biblia?(just clarifying sio)
if so, yes i think we should use our senses for interpretation but also pray to the holy spirit esp these modern times...kay sa karun panahona...tanang tao nagbasa sa bible pwede mu claim to have been guided by the holy spirit.

Talking about Luther, please take Note nga ang mga Protestante wa nag tuo ni Luther same sa pagtuo ninyu sa inyung santo Papa or saints. Lahi ra kaayu. Way Protestante nga Simbahan nagtudlo sa pagkatawo ni Luther, wa tawn mi ga discuss ana niya. Mas daghan paka nahibaloan anang Luther guro compare sa mga Protestant

Luther was just the one who started the Movement and modern Protestantism is the product of that movement NOT the product of his teachings. The only thing Luther did to protestants today is the IDEA that any people have the right to Question the Church and have the Right to search for the truth based on his own understanding. That's the start of Protestantism, you have the Bible as your based knowledge and you study it or study with other believers with it.

[/QUOTE]

kahibaw ko bai nga Luther just started protestantism but it doesnt necessarily follow nga mutuo mu ug unsay iyang interpretation..
and Lutheran is just one of the many sects of Protestantism.
i was just citing him and his POV as an example that Catholics and Protestant can do better in dealing with regard to our doctrine differences today rather than wasting time on debates such as the ones we have now.

was also just using his protest and interpretation about purgatory and indulgence as an example that anyone can have their own interpretation about verses.
mao di nato angay himuon nga basis nga sayop ang teaching if naay differences regarding practices
kay if you think about it, when protestantism broke, that was the start of the differences..
masabtan nato kung ninghawa sa congregation kay grabe na ang korakot...but naghimu pa jud ug lain nga doctrine..
Luther could have misinterpreted the bible verses he used in his thesis against purgatory and indulgence..
plus ato nga time kay grabe pud kaayo ang pagabusar sa Catholic church about selling the indulgence
therefore, it is possible that Luther could have been mistaken about his interpretations driven by many factors...
it could have been his disgust against the corrupt Catholic church leaders who permitted the selling of indulgence..
it could have been compassion...daghang factors...

in the same way pud nga di unta mu dapat mahimung absolute sa inyong POV about veneration of saints or Catholic practices nga dili ninyo ginabuhat...
kay in the long history of protestantism...ikaw ra mismo nag ingun..you do not even agree with all of Luther's "the first protestant or at least one of the Fathers of protestantism" Point of view..
your doctrines have evolved over time..one protestant church says one thing and another protestant church says otherwise..
ing ani ang nahitabo, Luther broke from the Catholic church and protestantism came...
karun perting nang daghana ug protestant, lain2x pa jud ug mga doctrines?
i am amazed that you can be so absolute in your interpretation sio, especially when you are using it
to disprove the Catholic Church's practices(the church where protestantism even came from)

like i said in my earlier posts, different doctrines(minor ones), POVs, and interpretations
are just normal 'cause the bible may be perfect but the people reading it(us) aren't.
even in One church, by just one verse, each member can actually give a different interpretation about that verse..
but they don't end up tearing the church apart though some may even disagree with the other church member's interpretation...
that should be our attitude unta as different parts of Christ's body...instead of wasting our times disproving the other church's practices.

[noy]

@noy: you didnt get my point bay noy...what i mean is atong sabton na ang root or ang origin sa cross symbol is heathen? im not saying bay noy na heathen is always a heathen. ang punto nako bay noy bah na ang root or origin sa cross is heathen symbol.

nagsugod nako ug kalibog bai why you had to ask me what my understanding about heathen was?
if your point is just to shed light about the history of the cross..
the article in the catholic encyclopedia you qouted is self explanatory naman about the history of the cross
that it has many meanings and one of the many is of heathen before Christ. i don't think it needs further elaboration.sorry

[noy]

naay nindot mga bro, pag search mo ug image pagkabata ni Calungsod, or himo himo lng base sa model image ni Calungsod nga katong basketball player. Himo-i ug rebolto nga fire proof. unya itapad ninyo sa rebolto ni Calungsod karon nga made of wood sa inyong simbahan or chapel. unya sunuga ang simbahan, unya mahabilin man gyud na ang bata nga Calungsod ky kabalo man ka nga fire proof. Malupigan pa lagi ng Calungsod karon sa bata nga Calungsod ky milagro kuno, himu-i dayon ug dance steps, kwarta lagi segurado, madato pa mo mga bro. unya himo-i ug mga design daan sa mga sinina nga patented ninyo ky naa baya unya na hubo hubo or ilis ilis nga ceremony

patented ang rebolto, mga design sa sinina ug dance steps, nindot kaayo na nga business

foul man ni jovs! Lol...

[noy]

In our modern times, The Title saints were given by Man not by God.

there was a certain verse sio nga the apostle paul adressed the people of a certain church as saints.
paul adressed the living as saints though the living may still fall in sin despite of their walk with the Lord.
how much more those those people who did not just lived with God's grace but Died in God's grace?
and i think the physically dead Christian has more spiritual level than those of the living and they cannot sin na pud diba?

anyone who claims heaven to be their final destination can claim to be a saint
but the canonization of certain saints is of a different purpose and process.

[MasterK]

naa napod ta aning kung wala nasuwat sa bibliya sayop.

pareho man gyud ta diri brad nga pinadupa gyud pagkalansang si Jesus ang gituhoan. wala pa may nikontra nato diri. ug dili man sad ko motuo nga sayop ang simbahan nato pagpasunod ana. ang ako lang ani kung asa gyud dapita sa bibliya ang bug-at nga rason nga makaingon tah "ah pinadupa gyud diay oi" maong krus (+) gyud atong gigamit nga simbolo sa kaluwasan ug dili katong poste ra nga walay crossbar ("crossbar" pulong gigamit ni @defender). nakita man gud nako diri nga bisan ang mga wala modawat ug tradisyon.(i respect their POV). nahauyon sad nga pinadupa gyud to atong ginoo. nianang mga sitwasyona nagtou gyud ko nga naa gyuy bug-at nga rason sa biliya ana. tingali wala lang ta kabantay sa mensahe asa dapita sa kasulatan. pero dunay mga tawo nga nakahibaw na ana unsay rason nga makaingon tah krus (+) gyud diay. kato sigurong dapita sa kasulatan nga gipas-an ni Jesus ang gilansangan niya, dili lang maklaro nato didto dapita.

huwat lang ko basin naa pa sad lain nahibaw-an ang uban nato diring mga batid sa bibliya. nga makapalig-on gyud sa atong pagtou sa krus. nga kon makakita tag krus makahinumdom gyud giunsa ta paghigugma sa dios.

kaning bahina sa pamahayag ni brad @noy moagree man gyud ko ani

... 'cause the bible may be perfect but the people reading it(us) aren't..

[NapoleonBlownapart]

pareha ra bitaw ta tanan diri mga tsismosa hahahaha. tsismis ra pud bitaw ng inyo gikan sa bible, gikan sa iyong pastor/pari nga nangtsimis ra pud ninyo hahaha. ang tsismis gi tsimis, aw nahimo ng tinood

at least ako napamatud-an na nako sa akong Self ang tinood.

Sorry to disappoint you jovi naa me gibasehan na facts from history unlike you.. I can also prove my belief is logical unlike you. Imo man me idamay anang imong binuang. Naay kuwang jovi. Ang tsismis gi tsismis nahimong murag tinood. That is so applicable sa imong belief. Mohirit pa maunay ra d.i.

Aw syempre sa imong kaugalingon ma prove jud na nimo. Ikaw na bitaw niangkon sa pikas thread nga way problema nimo bisan imo gituhuan kay bakak.. So regardless kun bakak or dili moana jud kang tinood kay mao gud imo gituhuan.. LOL

[defender_1611]

nagsugod nako ug kalibog bai why you had to ask me what my understanding about heathen was?
if your point is just to shed light about the history of the cross..
the article in the catholic encyclopedia you qouted is self explanatory naman about the history of the cross
that it has many meanings and one of the many is of heathen before Christ. i don't think it needs further elaboration.sorry

e analyze pag ayo bay noy ang statement sa new catholic encylopedia. kay mismo ang amung silingan na hapit na ma pari mismo siya niangkon na heathen or pagan symbols ang root or origin ana. so its your opinion bay noy so i respect that.