All Religion leads to God:maybe? Yes? No?

[jamesmusslewhite]

---

that's all. please be patient, okay. The world will not end tomorrow, relax. next time you accuse me of something be sure that you have the right information.

I asked #68 and you blew me off #72. It has nothing to do with Omega thread. That is a totally different thread. It does not matter. Don't worry about it. There is nothing I am really interested in listening to now anyway.

[jamesmusslewhite]

thats it as it is.. his family and neighbors wont like it, and may have to do measures to protect thier interests.. if he believes its a good thing let him, but he has to consider what "evil" others may do to him if he does such things. he should blame them, after-all, they are just after their own good and well-being...

its really hard to find inner-peace when you are at war with your neighbors.. but its a lot harder to make peace with your neighbors if you are at war with your self - losely translated from sun-tzu

True, but if the friends, family, and neighbors accept him and conduct themselves the same way, then the act would not seem evil rather for them it is just a normal act. A barbarian may not see his acts as barbaric because he sees right and wrong through the eyes of his accepting culture. Nazis did not see many of their worst acts as committing evils, they were able to justify their actions as a necessary process. It is only perceived as true evil if viewed that way by an opposing majority. An opposing minority can itself be perceived as evil by an afflicting majority. Good point.

I believe your paraphrase was,
""If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the results of a hundred battles," Sun Tzu

[Malic]

the one and same object
--- lols! did you know that we worship a totally different god? out of context pod imo premise brad! wrong imo assumption. means to say wrong na ang argument...

they are different in your book and I would appreciate it more if you can give the reasons why you think my position is wrong. So far what I get from you is a spineless accusation.

For a moment let us set aside the stuffs we have learn from our churches and for once think this through on our own. That way freewill is properly executed.

No they are not different. To prevent us from misrepresenting the word Religion in relation to our discussion, I guess its better that I should lay down the proper context.

In this discussion when we speak about Religion it refers to the major Religions of the world including the different denominations inside their category. For example Islam, that's the Religion and Sufism,Shiites,Sunnis etc. are the different denominations. Hope that explains the context well enough.

For me God is an abstract principle. No matter how any sacred books together with the best theologians of the entire world in every Religion define God there is always a hollow part in it, where no amount of intelligence can fill in. That's why we have sayings like "God is indescribable" and "God is unknowable" , etc. .

We used the word God or Allah only as title to address something or to that someone that is above us or to a supreme being and never as a word to address to someone that has concrete existence, like Dad, Mom, sister and etc..

God took a form when Religion starts to play smart and on that point then is where the division started. Finite minds then tried to form the abstract principle and shaped it according to the influences of their own culture.Fueled by instinct of survival each then declare their God as superior than others and the only true one God. Unfortunately bigotry is so strong that it made a deep mark inside man's psychological set up and thus it was carried through from one generation to another.

The great Religious figures of history didn't came here to established Religion, they were reformers of culture. After their departure the disciples' disciples started to collect their teachings then formed dogmas out of it and named the Religion after them.

if we go to the very core of the message of each Religion they are all the same, take away dogmas, all left is service to God and your fellow human being. James was right when he said 26If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless. 27Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

nowehre in that passage where it says Dogmas are marks of a true religion. Service through Love and compassion is what makes any religion pure. Not fighting and cursing over doctrines and theology (anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless).

[kebot]

they are different in your book and I would appreciate it more if you can give the reasons why you think my position is wrong. So far what I get from you is a spineless accusation.

For a moment let us set aside the stuffs we have learn from our churches and for once think this through on our own. That way freewill is properly executed.

No they are not different. To prevent us from misrepresenting the word Religion in relation to our discussion, I guess its better that I should lay down the proper context.

In this discussion when we speak about Religion it refers to the major Religions of the world including the different denominations inside their category. For example Islam, that's the Religion and Sufism,Shiites,Sunnis etc. are the different denominations. Hope that explains the context well enough.

For me God is an abstract principle. No matter how any sacred books together with the best theologians of the entire world in every Religion define God there is always a hollow part in it, where no amount of intelligence can fill in. That's why we have sayings like "God is indescribable" and "God is unknowable" , etc. .

We used the word God or Allah only as title to address something or to that someone that is above us or to a supreme being and never as a word to address to someone that has concrete existence, like Dad, Mom, sister and etc..

God took a form when Religion starts to play smart and on that point then is where the division started. Finite minds then tried to form the abstract principle and shaped it according to the influences of their own culture.Fueled by instinct of survival each then declare their God as superior than others and the only true one God. Unfortunately bigotry is so strong that it made a deep mark inside man's psychological set up and thus it was carried through from one generation to another.

The great Religious figures of history didn't came here to established Religion, they were reformers of culture. After their departure the disciples' disciples started to collect their teachings then formed dogmas out of it and named the Religion after them.

if we go to the very core of the message of each Religion they are all the same, take away dogmas, all left is service to God and your fellow human being. James was right when he said 26If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless. 27Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

nowehre in that passage where it says Dogmas are marks of a true religion. Service through Love and compassion is what makes any religion pure. Not fighting and cursing over doctrines and theology (anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless).

No they are not different. To prevent us from misrepresenting the word Religion in relation to our discussion, I guess its better that I should lay down the proper context.
--- i urge you to go to malaysia and tell your view point to the muslims there... they will tell you allah is muslim not for christians... So, if you still think you are right! yea you are right in your own right! sorry malic, muslims are burning churches protesting the word allah as the same God for christians... Try reading current events...

if we go to the very core of the message of each Religion they are all the same,
--- are you sure.
--- Allah told the muslims, kill the enemies of muslim; "You must convert to muslim or die".
--- Christ said Love one another; You dont have to know christ, but if you do its up to you to accept him.
--- those are two God, ordered different philosophy. Well?

Not fighting and cursing over doctrines and theology (anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless
--- yea you are right! but if somebody will tell you your dogma is the same as those who kill in the name of God? Sorry malic, it said there is no truth in them. Satan came to steal, kill and to destroy. Gud luck!

The great Religious figures of history didn't came here to established Religion, they were reformers of culture.
--- as for Christianity, he did not establish his own religion, but a fulfillment of the Old Testament, now Christ choose all kinds of people, brown, yellow, black and white. His commandment are no more exclusive to the jew, but for everyone. its up to you.

[jamesmusslewhite]

No they are not different. To prevent us from misrepresenting the word Religion in relation to our discussion, I guess its better that I should lay down the proper context.
--- i urge you to go to malaysia and tell your view point to the muslims there... they will tell you allah is muslim not for christians... So, if you still think you are right! yea you are right in your own right! sorry malic, muslims are burning churches protesting the word allah as the same God for christians... Try reading current events...

if we go to the very core of the message of each Religion they are all the same,
--- are you sure.
--- Allah told the muslims, kill the enemies of muslim; "You must convert to muslim or die".
--- Christ said Love one another; You dont have to know christ, but if you do its up to you to accept him.
--- those are two God, ordered different philosophy. Well?

Not fighting and cursing over doctrines and theology (anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless
--- yea you are right! but if somebody will tell you your dogma is the same as those who kill in the name of God? Sorry malic, it said there is no truth in them. Satan came to steal, kill and to destroy. Gud luck!

The great Religious figures of history didn't came here to established Religion, they were reformers of culture.
--- as for Christianity, he did not establish his own religion, but a fulfillment of the Old Testament, now Christ choose all kinds of people, brown, yellow, black and white. His commandment are no more exclusive to the jew, but for everyone. its up to you.

Good point and the logic is sound. Other members will just choose not to grasp it. They will not allow themselves to accept or understand, rather they will try to hold you to a higher standard than they themselves would allow to be imposed upon themselves.

They will call you close minded and a bigot. They will say that you are hateful and predigest, and that you must trust that they are right. They can not stand the fact you will not bend to their will, or believe that wich you know to be wrong. They will anger and down talk the teachings of Christ. How a man of peace can be vilified for giving his life so we can have ever lasting happiness, is beyond me. That is Satan's trick upon man, meant to keep men from the path to salvation. If you walk from Christ he will accept you back with open arms. Others (even some Christian Sects) if you walk away, they relieve your right to exist. Some roads lead to God, and some roads will lead to a downstairs residence with that "Great Deceiver of man."

You always stand fast and do not change or back down, and in the end you will be richly rewarded for your belief. Christ said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes to the Father, but by me." I trust the word of Christ over that of flawed men. No mater how much they bow, bend, meditate, spout prideful boast, or taunt and insult. His words were too simple for so call wise men to grasp. Wise men can be fools too, we are all flawed beings.

Bless you walk with Christ.

[Sinyalan]

Malic take my analogy :

First Student: study in-house (in-house learning)
Second Student: study in private school

Objective: They both want to learn.

Question: Which do you think is better?

We might have different perspective of the objective malic

If my god is MONEY its like saying I am a devotee too and im saved... Gud luck.

This is indirect analogy.

"in-house"? You mean "home-school". The objective here kebot is to save "money". Yes they are both learning but I prefer to be home-schooled than a religious-driven private school that sucks up more money that also learn the same way as the latter. It's the same with people who are HAPPY to devote their time, with their own space, with their own way than going to a church that sucks up your money that 85% of people are also needing money for food. clothing and shelter. Which do you prefer?

[Malic]

No they are not different. To prevent us from misrepresenting the word Religion in relation to our discussion, I guess its better that I should lay down the proper context.
--- i urge you to go to malaysia and tell your view point to the muslims there... they will tell you allah is muslim not for christians... So, if you still think you are right! yea you are right in your own right! sorry malic, muslims are burning churches protesting the word allah as the same God for christians... Try reading current events...

if we go to the very core of the message of each Religion they are all the same,
--- are you sure.
--- Allah told the muslims, kill the enemies of muslim; "You must convert to muslim or die".
--- Christ said Love one another; You dont have to know christ, but if you do its up to you to accept him.
--- those are two God, ordered different philosophy. Well?

of course they will but what you don't know is that Muslims believe that they alone are serving the God of Abraham and Moses. God in the Old testament commanded Moses to kill God's enemies. Can you see the similarity?

According to Muslim scholars, the Hebrew priesthood corrupted the scriptures of Moses, thus came Issa or Jesus to reform Mosaic laws and return it to its pristine form. Then further they said that Paul twisted the monotheistic concept of God and turned it tri-theistic in form and the worst of all they put Jesus,who is a man, as part of Godhead. So they claimed that Muslims alone not the Christians worshipped the God of Abraham and Moses in its purest form. That's why they would say that the Christian God is not the God of Moses and Abraham but rather the God that Paul made. Thus the claim that Allah in Arabic and Eli in Aramaic(arabic and aramaic and even hebrew are cousin tongues, even Allah and Eli does have a similar sound, and if these two words are written in arabic or aramaic they appear to look the same,they differ only in vowel pronunciation) is not for Christians does hold water.

see I end up educating you about some stuff. and this is very taxing on my part.

going back to the topic. I told you in my previous post to set aside everything we have learn in the churches because those are man made doctrines. Look for non-contradicting principles and there you will find the core teaching of every religion is the same. strip your mind of bigotry and be humane.

Not fighting and cursing over doctrines and theology (anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless
--- yea you are right! but if somebody will tell you your dogma is the same as those who kill in the name of God? Sorry malic, it said there is no truth in them. Satan came to steal, kill and to destroy. Gud luck!

you affirmed that its right and then in the next sentence you are protesting? what is that? what kind of an argument is that? then I would also like to point this one out for you, have a look...I already told you that dogmas divide people, so no need for you to repeat it again to me. In other words don't talk to me about dogmas because I am already in agreement that when it comes to that level Religion is divided.

The great Religious figures of history didn't came here to established Religion, they were reformers of culture.
--- as for Christianity, he did not establish his own religion, but a fulfillment of the Old Testament, now Christ choose all kinds of people, brown, yellow, black and white. His commandment are no more exclusive to the jew, but for everyone. its up to you.

Yes I already told you that ( see words in bold ).

kebot I will leave you here, cos I find your way very taxing, imo ra man ibalik akong mga ponto nga gipangsulti. I was expecting for counter-arguments point by point and your explanation of why you think I am wrong but instead what I got are repetitions of my points. Imo ra man gi repeat ang akong mga ponto nga gipanghatag. like ni ingon ko nga Jesus didn't came here to establish religion nya imo pod ra nga gi repeat akong gisulti. then katod pod about dogmas. cge ayo ayo diha.

[kebot]

This is indirect analogy.

"in-house"? You mean "home-school". The objective here kebot is to save "money". Yes they are both learning but I prefer to be home-schooled than a religious-driven private school that sucks up more money that also learn the same way as the latter. It's the same with people who are HAPPY to devote their time, with their own space, with their own way than going to a church that sucks up your money that 85% of people are also needing money for food. clothing and shelter. Which do you prefer?

The objective here kebot is to save "money"
--- hehehe! so why study? lols! u need to buy books bya! hahay! the objective is given yet you change it ngano kaha?

Yes they are both learning but I prefer to be home-schooled than a religious-driven private school
--- so kung sectarian? brad, murag you are way out of the context here. nobody mentioned religion or sectarian school. If ang private school is dool sa inyo balay, ang sectarian school 10km away... tell me which do you prefer! pagka lols jud!

[kebot]

of course they will but what you don't know is that Muslims believe that they alone are serving the God of Abraham and Moses. God in the Old testament commanded Moses to kill God's enemies. Can you see the similarity?

According to Muslim scholars, the Hebrew priesthood corrupted the scriptures of Moses, thus came Issa or Jesus to reform Mosaic laws and return it to its pristine form. Then further they said that Paul twisted the monotheistic concept of God and turned it tri-theistic in form and the worst of all they put Jesus,who is a man, as part of Godhead. So they claimed that Muslims alone not the Christians worshipped the God of Abraham and Moses in its purest form. That's why they would say that the Christian God is not the God of Moses and Abraham but rather the God that Paul made. Thus the claim that Allah in Arabic and Eli in Aramaic(arabic and aramaic and even hebrew are cousin tongues, even Allah and Eli does have a similar sound, and if these two words are written in arabic or aramaic they appear to look the same,they differ only in vowel pronunciation) is not for Christians does hold water.

see I end up educating you about some stuff. and this is very taxing on my part.

going back to the topic. I told you in my previous post to set aside everything we have learn in the churches because those are man made doctrines. Look for non-contradicting principles and there you will find the core teaching of every religion is the same. strip your mind of bigotry and be humane.




you affirmed that its right and then in the next sentence you are protesting? what is that? what kind of an argument is that? then I would also like to point this one out for you, have a look...I already told you that dogmas divide people, so no need for you to repeat it again to me. In other words don't talk to me about dogmas because I am already in agreement that when it comes to that level Religion is divided.



Yes I already told you that ( see words in bold ).

kebot I will leave you here, cos I find your way very taxing, imo ra man ibalik akong mga ponto nga gipangsulti. I was expecting for counter-arguments point by point and your explanation of why you think I am wrong but instead what I got are repetitions of my points. Imo ra man gi repeat ang akong mga ponto nga gipanghatag. like ni ingon ko nga Jesus didn't came here to establish religion nya imo pod ra nga gi repeat akong gisulti. then katod pod about dogmas. cge ayo ayo diha.

According to Muslim scholars, the Hebrew priesthood corrupted the scriptures of Moses
--- your witness must be a disinterester person or group. sorry malic, your witness is serving thier own purpose. How can you present a witness who is also the subject. How come your scholars said its corrupted, your KORAN IS WRITTEN AD, the event is BC there is a thousand years gap and YET YOUR WITNESS WITNESS THE CORRUPTION. Do you still believe malic? thats what you call FAITH.

Thus the claim that Allah in Arabic and Eli in Aramaic(arabic and aramaic and even hebrew are cousin tongues, even Allah and Eli does have a similar sound
--- see master jesus, it sound very the same... point is, it doesn't matter how it sound. you have to examine the quality and attributes, based on thier patterns.

see I end up educating you about some stuff. and this is very taxing on my part
--- lols did u? hmmm! so do we need to pay for you?

kebot I will leave you here, cos I find your way very taxing, imo ra man ibalik akong mga ponto nga gipangsulti.
--- yes i affirm, i just explain the part of christianity. I did not contradict. Is affirming wrong? Lols malic, What i did tell you is that Christ came as the continuation of Gods work. It was the father who establish that religion...
--- again whats wrong?

[dartzed]

so whichever you choose your purpose will still be the same weather you want to be with God or the Devil or whoever they call it
--- that is because bro, you assume, each religion/god is the same. religion/god = Cat
--- the problem bro is this: Are you sure you are killing the same CAT?

i think you still don't get it..

i don't equate religion nor god as the cat but rather the cat is just a tool an example for you to think what would you do when you are given all the raw materials/requirements.. would you do it for salvation or damnation..

there are only two religions in the world for me the religion that follows the Devil and the religion that follows God.. you have all the rights to chose and that is what they called free will the only gift of God that he promised to every man..

so tell me bro kebs will you be saved if you chose the religion who worship Allah?..