The EARLY CHRISTIAN'S ZEAL and CONVICTION

[Brownman_politiks]

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So what if Peter was commanded by God to feed His lambs and sheep? Does it mean to become the head of the universal church? If mao man gani pasabot ana, is that your basis for Apostolic succession? c'mon mister higher knowledge!

Universal Church? intawn pod ni si Mr.Elementary, maglisod man og sabot og simple nga verse oi.

Asa gud diha sa verse ga ingon nga universal church?

ang pasabot ana nga verses Mr. 3rd eye kay gitagaan og special nga awtoridad si Peter.

among the disciples who were present at that time si Peter ang gi pili ni Jesus nga gihatagan og instruction to "take care and feed his sheeps". dili si John og ang obang disipolo but si Pedro.

osbon ko og palihug abliha imong 3rd eye para kasabot ka. nga kato nga scene nagpakita nga adunay pagsalig si Jesus ni Peter inspite sa iyang denial. mao ng gitagaan siya og awtoridad to take responsibility sa sheeps ni Jesus.

so kung sheep ka ni Jesus og nagpuyo ka sa panahon ni Pedro gapasabot nga adunay authority is Pedro over you. gets?

Jesus is subtly reminding Peter of his three denials. There’s no doubt those denials and how he felt when Jesus turned to look at him at that moment were seared deeply into Peter’s mind (Luke 22:54–62). It wasn’t lost on Peter that Jesus repeated His question to him three times, just as Peter previously denied Him three times.
Why did Jesus ask Peter "Do you love me?" three times?

pataka man lang ka og copy-paste. gamita lagi imong utok o kaha imong 3rd eye para makasabot ka.

ang 3 ka pangutana nga do you love me was first of all to signify Peter's peculiar authority, ika duha it was to insure Peter's faith in Jesus kay in the next verse after Jesus' last question, Jesus prophesied Peter's martyrdom. gets?

ambot kaha kung nakasabot ba ka sa akong pasabot hahaha.

mura ba gisogoro jud ni Jesus ang kang Pedro nga gugma niya pinaagi sa pagbalik balik sa pangutana kay naka balo na daan si Jesus nga si Pedro e martyr, lisod nga klase nga kamatayon ang atubangon ni Pedro in the future mao ng gi balik balik siya ug pangutana.

I hope kasabot ka. it was not as you say nga gi remind siya sa iyang denial. hahaahahahahaha, kalayo sa imong context Mr. Elementary ui.

tanawa katilaw hinoon ka og lecture nako hahahaha.

ambot lang kung nakasabot ba kaha ka anang feed my lambs, feed my sheeps now youre referring that to the Roman Catholics? mao ni imong pasabot sa lambs or sheeps ni Jesus Christ? unsa ni imoha, joke?

ay sus kasayon ra ana sabton, ako pa.

ikaw hinoon ang angay pangutan-on kung kasabot ba ka ana kay simple rule sa exegesis og context di nimo ma apply gani, pataka lang ka og copy-paste. di ka ma owaw ana?

Peter being the oldest of the apostles but maoy halfhearted of his faith sa Ginoo, thats the reason why God asked him multiple times to remind him of his upcoming role as the leader of the new Church, the Body of Christ there in Jerusalem (not ROME) that will be responsible for spreading the gospel after Jesus’ ascension into heaven.

basaha og osab ang mga versikolo dodong elementary kay inig abot nimo sa verse 18 gi prophesy ni Jesus iyang martyrdom. so in other words, gi sigorado jud ni Jesus. kay di sayon ng e martyr ka. di na natural nga kamatayon. mao ng gibalik balik ni Hesus ang pangutanang Do you love me. hahahaha.

katilaw hinoon ka og lecture, abliha lagi na imong 3rd eye para makasabot ka.

unsay not in Rome? pataka napod ka. naa ba gud gisulti ang verse nga sa Jerusalem ra siya dunay authority? ingon sa verse SHEEPS so kung sheep ka ni Jesus ma naa ka sa Jerusalem o Rome under ka sa leadership ni Peter. paeta nimo oi naglisod man ka og sabot. hahaa.

nya nabatasan pud ni ninyo nga pasagad lag interpret or angkon ug verses nga perteng layoa ra sa tinuod sa inyong teachings and doctrines! the tree is known by its fruit migo, ayaw sigeg quote ug verses kung ang-angan ra kayo imong supporting evidence.

hahahahahaaha....

ikaw man hinooy nasakpan nga nagpataka lang og gamit og verses. to remind Peter kono sa iyang denial, hahaha.

basaha ang context ui wa jud hint nga it was a reminder of Peter's denial.

bisan pag imong third eye iapil kung buta sad, di gyud gihapon magsilbi try harder migo.

I suggest nga e open nimo imong 3rd eye, kay lupig naka nako.

pasabot ana nga shifting sand si Peter and He's not the ROCK mentioned in Matthew 16:18. Unsa diay explaination sa imong advance knowledge? kindly share....

unswaaaaaaaaaaaa.


ayaw sigeg focus anang word nga rock , diretsoha ang verse kay in the latter part naay suwat diha sa verse 19 " I will give you the keys..." and in those time keys signifies authority.

[<SMILE>]

So its not really JESUS personally formed the Roman Catholic Religion - BUT you can trace its roots to Jesus. Just like the rest of Christian religions today. Its just that RC religion is CLOSER from the source than the newer ones

I could say the original church of Jesus Christ adapted by the roman emperor before,
copycat ra nang uban sio, unya hinimo ra pud sa tawo.

[<SMILE>]

not just the christians in rome but all the christians everywhere nga nakatag sa Roman Empire.

see this video bro, youll be amazed giunsa nila pagtago2 from the persecution especially the cappadocians.





you know bro, dako kayo nang lalisonon ang claims sa RC nga apostolic succession and only Peter was given authority by Jesus Christ to rule the churches!

If we read through the whole context, its not only Peter that Jesus was talking to but the disciples! also kung imong tan-awn on verse 23, Jesus even call Peter after he said...."thou art Peter..." nga Get thee behind me Satan!

Now, if Peter was the ROCK as what RC claim in verse 18, then why Peter denied the Lord three times during his trial?

Matthew 16
13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
20 Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.
21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.
22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.
23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Who is Peter with Jesus and who we are in the eyes of GOD,
none is perfect because Satan is roaming and tempting if we are sinning is it us or is it because of the influence of the devil?. Peter was with Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ did choose Peter to pursue the succession then how about the so many denomination are they with Jesus Christ before or just incorporate themselves in the name of faith?.

[<SMILE>]

Seems to be we're new to Apostasy.

When the Israelites murmured against God did Moses and Joshua created a splinter group?
The Israelites were not perfect such as the church today this should not be the cause for separation.

A church was already established before why make a new one based upon the flawed judgment and understanding of men, tan-awa si Jim Jones, instead of offering the blood of Christ he offered his deluded flock with kool-aids.

James Warren "Jim" Jones (May 13, 1931 – November 18, 197 was an American religious leader and community organizer. Jones was the founder and leader of the Peoples Temple, best known for the mass murder-suicide in November 1978 of 909 of its members in Jonestown, Guyana,[1] the murder of Congressman Leo Ryan, and the ordering of four additional Temple member deaths in Georgetown, the Guyanese capital. Nearly three-hundred children were murdered at Jonestown, almost all of them by cyanide poisoning.[2] Jones died from a gunshot wound to the head; it is suspected his death was a suicide.

Jones was born in Indiana and started the Temple there in the 1950s. He later moved the Temple to California in the mid-1960s, and gained notoriety with the move of the Temple's headquarters to San Francisco in the early 1970s.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Jones

[Tetrad]

brownman_politiks

Universal Church? intawn pod ni si Mr.Elementary, maglisod man og sabot og simple nga verse oi. Asa gud diha sa verse ga ingon nga universal church?

Kani may insakto dli tong hinanggaw
Its not my claim im just quoting it. Mao nay angay nimo iklaro kay mao nay giclaim sa mga katoliko nga si Peter daw ang head sa universal church!

ang pasabot ana nga verses Mr. 3rd eye kay gitagaan og special nga awtoridad si Peter.

Whatt? Mao na ang gipasabot ana or imo nang own interpretation? Hahahah. Pagsure pader! Quote a single verse that Jesus gave Peter the authority over the rest of the Apostles. Just one verse! Next time when interpreting a verse, read the whole context and analyze it properly.

Or hatagan takag chance, lets say Peter was given supremacy above the rest of the Apostles, now settle this:

If Jesus had already appointed Peter, why on the last night before Jesus was to die, when He and His disciples were eating the Passover, nganong naglalis paman sila of who among them should be accounted the GREATEST? Read Luke chapter 22:24. Unsa may gitubag ni Jesus? Niingon ba sya si Peter? Tingali ang imong pagsabot kay tungod si Peter maoy pinaka eldest sa tanang Apostles, sya na ang gihimong leader…..saon!

25 Jesus said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who exercise authority over them call themselves Benefactors. 26 But you are not to be like that. Instead, the greatest among you should be like the youngest, and the one who rules like the one who serves. 27 For who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who is at the table? But I am among you as one who serves.

Now, unsay panabot nimo ana nga statement “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them..?” [B]parehas ba sa Papal Power nga Pyramid structure as having the supremacy above all?[/B] Think pader…

How about this…
If Peter was ordained the head of all the followers of Christ then how about the intervention of Jesus after his resurrection to Apostle Paul on his way to Damascus? Nagpatudlo ba si Paul ni Peter? Si Peter ba ang nagbaptize niya? Why would Jesus use him so powerfully that Paul have the greatest contribution in the teachings of the New Testament, He wrote 14 books while Peter only 2? The truth is he did not have to learn anything from Peter. The bible is clear that Paul did not get his Christian theology training from ANY human man or the local church. He was taught and trained DIRECTLY by Jesus Christ. Read Gal.1:11,12.

What did Paul wrote when he visits Jerusalem? He acknowledged the pillars but it was James being recognized first then Peter…then reflect on what verse 6 mean to you!

6 As for those who were held in high esteem—whatever they were makes no difference to me; God does not show favoritism—they added nothing to my message. 7 On the contrary, they recognized that I had been entrusted with the task of preaching the gospel to the uncircumcised,[a] just as Peter had been to the circumcised.[b] 8 For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised, was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles. 9 James, Cephas[Peter] and John, those esteemed as pillars….

Paul had been taught by Christ who had already taught His first 12 apostles that no one of them had primacy over the others, but they were all to be servants to each other, just as Jesus Himself came not to be served but to serve. gets naka?

How about this…
When Peter came to Antioch and behaved himself not according to the truth but against the truth that had been established by the whole church, Paul was swift to CORRECT him, and that before ALL. Why did he rebuked Peter? Think again pader!

Galatians 2:11-14King James Version (KJV)

11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he (Peter) was to be blamed.
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

There were many large problems at times in the NT church and it was Paul who deals with many in different congregations. Wala gyud ta kabasa in the whole new testament nga that Paul ask or requested Peter being the head or having primacy above them to solve the matters. We cannot find any words used like: "I shall take this to Peter for his decision" or "This is such a large issue that Peter will need be called to exercise his keys of the Kingdom" or "As Peter is to teach and feed the flock, the apostles, and elders, we will wait on him for his judgment and final authoritative verdict."

How about in the writings of Peter itself?

Peter wrote only 2 (two) letters that are part of the inspired NT. He had all the opportunity unta in those letters to set the doctrine of his primacy down for all the church throughout all the ages. But have you read such claims? He did call himself "an apostle" and "an elder" but never THE apostle, or "the head of the church" or "the one who has the primacy over all apostles and elders."

There are lots of passages I can quote but I will just stop here coz mabored nya kag basa, mag linawgaw nasad

among the disciples who were present at that time si Peter ang gi pili ni Jesus nga gihatagan og instruction to "take care and feed his sheeps". dili si John og ang obang disipolo but si Pedro.

Instructions? Please be specific unsa nga instruction. If you mean to feed the sheep, to feed the lambs…then how about the rest of the Apostles? Naglingkod ra diay sila nag agad kang Peter? If we’re going to compare Paul and Peter, to whom did Jesus used effectively for his purpose?

What's your point?
Paul was used to teach and preach to the Gentiles WAY MORE than Peter, and Paul was used to write more than Peter. So if we want to use comparisons then we could say that Paul had more primacy than Peter. Do you agree?

osbon ko og palihug abliha imong 3rd eye para kasabot ka. nga kato nga scene nagpakita nga adunay pagsalig si Jesus ni Peter inspite sa iyang denial. mao ng gitagaan siya og awtoridad to take responsibility sa sheeps ni Jesus.

so kung sheep ka ni Jesus og nagpuyo ka sa panahon ni Pedro gapasabot nga adunay authority is Pedro over you. gets?

Ikaw maoy wa kagets sa passages in the bible! Jesus only helps Peter to strengthen this faith kay tiguwang na nya kuwang gihapog pagsalig! I don’t have to expound, just sabot the whole chapter of Matthew 16 and John 21. Think deeper pader!

Before we proceed with the issue on Matthew 16 as Peter being the “Rock”, try to research first the comparison between PETROS and PETRA.

To help you on this…
Matthew 16:18 - Upon This Rock

pataka man lang ka og copy-paste. gamita lagi imong utok o kaha imong 3rd eye para makasabot ka.
ang 3 ka pangutana nga do you love me was first of all to signify Peter's peculiar authority, ika duha it was to insure Peter's faith in Jesus kay in the next verse after Jesus' last question, Jesus prophesied Peter's martyrdom. gets?

Maluoy mansad ta nimo pader ui, nangugat na gyud tawn pero wa gyud kaigo! Mao ni imong advance knowledge pader?

Peculiar authority and Peter’s martyrdom, mao na imong basis that Jesus grant him primacy of the Apostles? How about the martyrdom of the rest? Ka special gud ni Peter kung iya rang death ang gihatagan importance ni Jesus Christ?

Andrew: Martyrdom by crucifixion (bound, not nailed, to a cross)
Bartholomew (Often identified with Nathaniel in the New Testament): Martyrdom by being either Beheaded or Flayed alive and crucified, head downward
James the Greater: Martyrdom by being beheaded or stabbed with a sword.
James the Lesser: Martyrdom by being thrown from a pinnacle of the Temple at Jerusalem , then stoned and beaten with clubs
John: Died of old age
Jude (Often identified with Thaddeus in the New Testament): Martyrdom by being beaten to death with a club
Judas: Suicide
Matthew: Martyrdom by being burned, stoned, or beheaded
Peter: Martyrdom by crucifixion at Rome with his head downwards
Philip: Martyrdom
Simon: Martyrdom by crucifixion.1 or being sawn in half
Thomas: Martyrdom by being stabbed with a spear

ambot kaha kung nakasabot ba ka sa akong pasabot hahaha.
mura ba gisogoro jud ni Jesus ang kang Pedro nga gugma niya pinaagi sa pagbalik balik sa pangutana kay naka balo na daan si Jesus nga si Pedro e martyr, lisod nga klase nga kamatayon ang atubangon ni Pedro in the future mao ng gi balik balik siya ug pangutana.
I hope kasabot ka. it was not as you say nga gi remind siya sa iyang denial. hahaahahahahaha, kalayo sa imong context Mr. Elementary ui.
tanawa katilaw hinoon ka og lecture nako hahahaha.

Lectura pako pader! Ganahan ko…hehe.
Jesus reminded Peter sa iyang pagkaweak by not minding the things of God. Mura bag gipa affirm gyud niya kang Peter that being an Apostle, they have much greater things to fulfill kay murag lax ra kayo si Peter even after Jesus resurrection! Si pedro dodong mangingisda, mura nibalik sya focus sa iyang career pagkamatay sa Ginoo.

Matthew 16
23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Now go back to John 21…Jesus encourages Peter to follow him, to become fishers of men…dili pagpangisda!

15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdest thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not.

19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

ay sus kasayon ra ana sabton, ako pa.
ikaw hinoon ang angay pangutan-on kung kasabot ba ka ana kay simple rule sa exegesis og context di nimo ma apply gani, pataka lang ka og copy-paste. di ka ma owaw ana?

Mauwaw ko pader kung maghinambog ko nga Im having an advance knowledge than anybody here nya pulos non-sense hapit ang mga posts. The truth will defend itself pader bisan unsa pay imong style to trashtalk!

unsay not in Rome? pataka napod ka. naa ba gud gisulti ang verse nga sa Jerusalem ra siya dunay authority? ingon sa verse SHEEPS so kung sheep ka ni Jesus ma naa ka sa Jerusalem o Rome under ka sa leadership ni Peter. paeta nimo oi naglisod man ka og sabot. hahaa.

Toinks!
Kapoi explain sa usa ka buta pader!

hahahahahaaha....
ikaw man hinooy nasakpan nga nagpataka lang og gamit og verses. to remind Peter kono sa iyang denial, hahaha.
basaha ang context ui wa jud hint nga it was a reminder of Peter's denial.
bisan pag imong third eye iapil kung buta sad, di gyud gihapon magsilbi try harder migo.
I suggest nga e open nimo imong 3rd eye, kay lupig naka nako.

Okay, daog naka pader….may nalang malipay sad ka ginagmay ba nya uwawan dinagko. Jowk!

unswaaaaaaaaaaaa.
ayaw sigeg focus anang word nga rock , diretsoha ang verse kay in the latter part naay suwat diha sa verse 19 " I will give you the keys..." and in those time keys signifies authority.

Unsa imong sabot, did Jesus whispered it to Peter alone? Kinsay audience ana nga passage, si Peter ra>?

By the way, what the Apostles did after they received the keys of the Kingdom?

“Keys” were the symbols of knowledge or the fruits of the scribal or teaching office (see Luke 11:52) where “keys” refer to knowledge. The “keys of the kingdom” refer to the Gospel of Christ. The use of those keys will build the church. Peter used the “keys” at Pentecost (Acts 2:14), at Samaria (Acts 8:14), and at the house of Cornelius the Gentile (Acts 10).

Tingalig imong pagtuo aning keys of the kingdom kay imong occultism (secret knowledge) pader!

[Tetrad]

Who is Peter with Jesus and who we are in the eyes of GOD,
none is perfect because Satan is roaming and tempting if we are sinning is it us or is it because of the influence of the devil?. Peter was with Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ did choose Peter to pursue the succession then how about the so many denomination are they with Jesus Christ before or just incorporate themselves in the name of faith?.

ITs our relationship with God that matters bro, its not our membership in a certain organization!
How about those faithful outside of the Catholic church? Is it logical to say nga mas malangit pa ang mga sugarol or palahubog nga katoliko compare nila?

The verses of salvation in the bible emphasizes our accpetance/relationship to our Saviour, not with any denominations!

[<SMILE>]

ITs our relationship with God that matters bro, its not our membership in a certain organization!
How about those faithful outside of the Catholic church? Is it logical to say nga mas malangit pa ang mga sugarol or palahubog nga katoliko compare nila?

The verses of salvation in the bible emphasizes our accpetance/relationship to our Saviour, not with any denominations!

Jesus Christ was here please do remember that,
and about salvation it is only us who should save ourselves as per the other discussion free will.
Jesus Christ did establish the church and with utmost care we should follow it and should be respected by other congregations.

[Brownman_politiks]

Kani may insakto dli tong hinanggaw
Its not my claim im just quoting it. Mao nay angay nimo iklaro kay mao nay giclaim sa mga katoliko nga si Peter daw ang head sa universal church!

In some sense sakto ang katoliko because Peter has a prominent place in Christendom during and after Jesus death.

People looked up to him, asked for his council, leads the church in different ways by example, died a martyr.

Whatt? Mao na ang gipasabot ana or imo nang own interpretation? Hahahah. Pagsure pader! Quote a single verse that Jesus gave Peter the authority over the rest of the Apostles. Just one verse! Next time when interpreting a verse, read the whole context and analyze it properly.

ikaw kono pag quote og osa ka verse nga gi ingnan si Peter ni Jesus, nga wa kay authority over sa church? sige kono...

unsay what? LOL. nganong mo qoute man ko og verse nga naa naman koy verse nga gi quote.

yes kaayo ui, ang pasabot ato nga verse is si Peter gitagaan og special nga awtoridad over Jesus' sheeps.

Among the disciples, gi pili ra ni Jesus si Peter para sultihan nga "Take care and Feed my Sheeps". that's something, liman ka si Jesus gi personal jud ka ug istorya nga "take care of my sheep" sa ato pa dako ang pagsalig ni Jesus kang Peter.

ikaw maka quote ka og verse nga adunay laing disciples nga gi ingnan ni Jesus nga "take care of my sheeps?" LOL.

Or hatagan takag chance, lets say Peter was given supremacy above the rest of the Apostles, now settle this:

If Jesus had already appointed Peter, why on the last night before Jesus was to die, when He and His disciples were eating the Passover, nganong naglalis paman sila of who among them should be accounted the GREATEST? Read Luke chapter 22:24. Unsa may gitubag ni Jesus? Niingon ba sya si Peter? Tingali ang imong pagsabot kay tungod si Peter maoy pinaka eldest sa tanang Apostles, sya na ang gihimong leader…..saon!

Diri na jud ma kita og ma klaro ang imong pagka elementary.

kini nga scenario Mr. 3rd eye, the last supper ni. katong scenario nga "take care and feed my sheep", pagkahoman nato sa iyang resurrection. sa ato pa ang pag hatag ug authority ni Peter nahitabo pagka homan na sa ilang lalis sa last supper. gets? LOL

nalibog naka Mr.Elementary? nga hasta ang chronology sa kinabuhi ni Jesus imong gi katag, haha. pagka Elementary pa jud nimo.

25 Jesus said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them; and those who exercise authority over them call themselves Benefactors. 26 But you are not to be like that. Instead, the greatest among you should be like the youngest, and the one who rules like the one who serves. 27 For who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who is at the table? But I am among you as one who serves.

Now, unsay panabot nimo ana nga statement “The kings of the Gentiles lord it over them..?” [B]parehas ba sa Papal Power nga Pyramid structure as having the supremacy above all?[/B] Think pader…

pssst, kini nga verses wa ni nagpasabot nga di puede ng leader leader sa christianity, but gi describe diri characteristic sa osa ka leader.

How about this…
If Peter was ordained the head of all the followers of Christ then how about the intervention of Jesus after his resurrection to Apostle Paul on his way to Damascus? Nagpatudlo ba si Paul ni Peter? Si Peter ba ang nagbaptize niya? Why would Jesus use him so powerfully that Paul have the greatest contribution in the teachings of the New Testament, He wrote 14 books while Peter only 2? The truth is he did not have to learn anything from Peter. The bible is clear that Paul did not get his Christian theology training from ANY human man or the local church. He was taught and trained DIRECTLY by Jesus Christ. Read Gal.1:11,12.

pagka elementary pa jud og panabot nimo.

ikaw kinsay nagtudlo nimo og 1+1=3 ang presidente ba sa pinas? di sa. hehe. pero under ka sa authority sa president sa pinas. gets? mao pod na ka pablo, di si pedro ang gatudlo apan under siya sa authority ni Pedro until si Pablo naghimo himo og iyang kaugalingong sekta.

nalimot naka sigoro nga nihangyo intawn si pablo sa church sa jerusalem nga di na e strikto ang pag implementar sa balaod didto sa mga gentiles, kana lang daan nagpasabot nga si Pablo was under their authority.

What did Paul wrote when he visits Jerusalem? He acknowledged the pillars but it was James being recognized first then Peter…then reflect on what verse 6 mean to you!

6 As for those who were held in high esteem—whatever they were makes no difference to me; God does not show favoritism—they added nothing to my message. 7 On the contrary, they recognized that I had been entrusted with the task of preaching the gospel to the uncircumcised,[a] just as Peter had been to the circumcised.[b] 8 For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised, was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles. 9 James, Cephas[Peter] and John, those esteemed as pillars….

Paul had been taught by Christ who had already taught His first 12 apostles that no one of them had primacy over the others, but they were all to be servants to each other, just as Jesus Himself came not to be served but to serve. gets naka?

ka elementary pa jud intawn.

ang pasabot ana kay sa mata sa Ginoo patas ra sila tanan.

BUT in any organization duna jud nay leader nga diin tagaan og authority to lead the organization. ayaw ko ingna nga sa inyong simbahan way pastor? nabuang na.

ayaw ko ingna nga sa inyong simbahan way Seniority? way elders? walay president? kadakong inamaw gud ana kung mao na. LOL

How about this…
When Peter came to Antioch and behaved himself not according to the truth but against the truth that had been established by the whole church, Paul was swift to CORRECT him, and that before ALL. Why did he rebuked Peter? Think again pader!

Galatians 2:11-14King James Version (KJV)

11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he (Peter) was to be blamed.
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

kung leader ka dodong elementary wa nagpasabot nga tanan na lang tao mo yango sa imong desisyon duna jud nay mosopak. because in any organization lahi lahi ang personality sa tao, and because of that duna jud nay clashes of opinion. gets?

ka elementary pa jud nimo ui.

There were many large problems at times in the NT church and it was Paul who deals with many in different congregations. Wala gyud ta kabasa in the whole new testament nga that Paul ask or requested Peter being the head or having primacy above them to solve the matters. We cannot find any words used like: "I shall take this to Peter for his decision" or "This is such a large issue that Peter will need be called to exercise his keys of the Kingdom" or "As Peter is to teach and feed the flock, the apostles, and elders, we will wait on him for his judgment and final authoritative verdict."

ay sus ka binata pa jud nimo og panabot.

ka daghan problema sa atong nasud, apan ang pangutana tanan ba nga problema ang presidente mo solbad? LOL.

same ra pod na sa imong gi example. di tanang problema si pedro mo solbad.

wa diay ka kabasa nga nisuwat si Pablo sa Church Council sa Jerusalem kay nangayo og solbad sa osa ka doctrinal issue? hahaha. unsa diay ng bibliyaha imong gibasa, giputol to nga page?

How about in the writings of Peter itself?

Peter wrote only 2 (two) letters that are part of the inspired NT. He had all the opportunity unta in those letters to set the doctrine of his primacy down for all the church throughout all the ages. But have you read such claims? He did call himself "an apostle" and "an elder" but never THE apostle, or "the head of the church" or "the one who has the primacy over all apostles and elders."

There are lots of passages I can quote but I will just stop here coz mabored nya kag basa, mag linawgaw nasad

So ngano man diay kung 2 ra ka letters, timan-e si Peter di kaayo to edukado kay fisherman ra, si Pablo kay scholar to so naturally mas anad mo suwat si Pablo. LOL , but it doesn't mean nga di na to leader si Pedro tungod kay 2 ra ang letter nabutang sa iyang pangan .

hasta kini wa ka kasabot, paeta nimo Mr.Elementary.

Instructions? Please be specific unsa nga instruction. If you mean to feed the sheep, to feed the lambs…then how about the rest of the Apostles? Naglingkod ra diay sila nag agad kang Peter? If we’re going to compare Paul and Peter, to whom did Jesus used effectively for his purpose?

paeta utoka, saman di na kaya, hangyo lang kay ako ning undangon haha.

wa gani gisultihan, nya mangutana pa ka "how about the rest of the apostles?" tsk tsk.

What's your point?
Paul was used to teach and preach to the Gentiles WAY MORE than Peter, and Paul was used to write more than Peter. So if we want to use comparisons then we could say that Paul had more primacy than Peter. Do you agree?

taka lang ka da.

ang doctor mas gamit pa kaysa presidente apan ang presidente above sa doctor. gets nimo ang logic? kay imong logic diring dapita hagbong.

Ikaw maoy wa kagets sa passages in the bible! Jesus only helps Peter to strengthen this faith kay tiguwang na nya kuwang gihapog pagsalig! I don’t have to expound, just sabot the whole chapter of Matthew 16 and John 21. Think deeper pader!

hahaha, taka na lang ug tubag ai haha, wa ma igo sa akong post. nagsalimoang na.

Before we proceed with the issue on Matthew 16 as Peter being the “Rock”, try to research first the comparison between PETROS and PETRA.

To help you on this…
Matthew 16:18 - Upon This Rock

mana ko ana ig toon ui dugay na.

Maluoy mansad ta nimo pader ui, nangugat na gyud tawn pero wa gyud kaigo! Mao ni imong advance pader?

Peculiar authority and Peter’s martyrdom, mao na imong basis that Jesus grant him primacy of the Apostles? How about the martyrdom of the rest? Ka special gud ni Peter kung iya rang death ang gihatagan importance ni Jesus Christ?

Andrew: Martyrdom by crucifixion (bound, not nailed, to a cross)
Bartholomew (Often identified with Nathaniel in the New Testament): Martyrdom by being either Beheaded or Flayed alive and crucified, head downward
James the Greater: Martyrdom by being beheaded or stabbed with a sword.
James the Lesser: Martyrdom by being thrown from a pinnacle of the Temple at Jerusalem , then stoned and beaten with clubs
John: Died of old age
Jude (Often identified with Thaddeus in the New Testament): Martyrdom by being beaten to death with a club
Judas: Suicide
Matthew: Martyrdom by being burned, stoned, or beheaded
Peter: Martyrdom by crucifixion at Rome with his head downwards
Philip: Martyrdom
Simon: Martyrdom by crucifixion.1 or being sawn in half
Thomas: Martyrdom by being stabbed with a spear

taka man lang ka ug basa. ni ingon ba gud ko nga ang peculiar authority ug martyrdom ni peter ang basis sa iyang authority? wa na pod ka kasabot sa ininglis?

ni ingon ko nga katong pangutana nga do you love me gibuhat to ni Jesus to insure Peter's faith kay e martyr siya in the future.

pataka man lang ka og sabot sa akong gi post. LOL

nisamot na jud pagka obvious imong pagka elementary.

Lectura pako pader! Ganahan ko…hehe.

o oi lecturan ka nako para ma open imong 3rd eye.

Jesus reminded Peter sa iyang pagkaweak by not minding the things of God. Mura bag gipa affirm gyud niya kang Peter that being an Apostle, they have much greater things to fulfill kay murag lax ra kayo si Peter even after Jesus resurrection! Si pedro dodong mangingisda, mura nibalik sya focus sa iyang career pagkamatay sa Ginoo.

taka na pod ka og interpret hahaha. basaha lagi ang context dodong elementary.

just by reading your response dodong ako jud makita nga i am way ahead of you when it comes to bible interpretation.

Matthew 16
23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Now go back to John 21…Jesus encourages Peter to follow him, to become fishers of men…dili pagpangisda!

15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.

18 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdest thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not.

19 This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me.

hahahaha, wrong exegesis, paeta. I doubt nga nka eskwela ka og Hermeneutics hahaha kay sa imong pagsumpay you have violated one simple rule, that is to observe the context.

lahi ug context ng John dodong ug lahi pod ng naa sa Matthew hahahaha.

nya kay imong man gi sumpay pasabot, wa kay alamag sa rules sa bible interpretation. kung pastor man gani ka paka owaw ka lang.

Mauwaw ko pader kung maghinambog ko nga Im having an advance knowledge than anybody here nya pulos non-sense hapit ang mga posts. The truth will defend itself pader bisan unsa pay imong style to trashtalk!

truth sa imong mata nga utlimo basic rule sa pag interpret di nimo makuha.

Unsa imong sabot, did Jesus whispered it to Peter alone? Kinsay audience ana nga passage, si Peter ra>?

naa na pod ka anang mga pangutana nga nagpaila lang sa imong pagka elementary.

By the way, what the Apostles did after they received the keys of the Kingdom?

“Keys” were the symbols of knowledge or the fruits of the scribal or teaching office (see Luke 11:52) where “keys” refer to knowledge. The “keys of the kingdom” refer to the Gospel of Christ. The use of those keys will build the church. Peter used the “keys” at Pentecost (Acts 2:14), at Samaria (Acts 8:14), and at the house of Cornelius the Gentile (Acts 10).

haha wa naman tawn ka sa topic ui.


da katilaw hinoon ka, puro ka hambog, kasugat na hinoon ka og tinood nga nagtoon og bible (saona)

na expose na hinoon ang imong pagka elementary.

sa sunod ayaw pataka og quote kay di ka makapasar nako.

[Tetrad]

Jesus Christ was here please do remember that,
and about salvation it is only us who should save ourselves as per the other discussion free will.
Jesus Christ did establish the church and with utmost care we should follow it and should be respected by other congregations.

then wahts the purpose of Jesus death, burial and resurrection being God nagpakamatay kung kita raman diay makabuhat sa atong kaluwasan?

The church brod is the collective body of believers of Jesus Christ.....not the building in Vatican!
whether your a protestant, catholic, baptists, etc....when you have Christ in your life, automatically in spiritual sense youll become part of the Church!

[GreyGargoyle]