Strong faith in God BUT Losing hope to Religions

[anubiz]

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apili nalang pud ug basa sa bible para kompleto.. hehe

hahaha tagsa ra kaayo ko mo basa sa bible pero mo basa gyud ko.

[rafee]

@noy


Sal-ot lang ko gamay noy

Kung tawhanon nga pagkasulti uyon ko ani. Pero depende ni sya kay naay cases nga kaning klase sa reaction nga magdepende sa amount gihatag are for those Leaders nga Carnal, Materialistic tingali (sorry for the word). But for a spiritual leader (Priest,Pastor) whose eyes is set on the things of God, ang intention ug kasing2 sa naghatag maoy importante para niya. Sa bagay Ginoo ray nakabalo how sincere ang paghatag.
Naa man gud usahay kaning wealthy nga mga taw with their ego and pride kwarta ray palihokon, thinking acceptable na sa Ginoo ilang amount gihatag diay sinsiyo ra sa ilang income. Naa pud ultimo ug uyamot nga taw like sa poor widow nga bisan wala nay pangpalit sud-an unya 5pesos ray iyang nahatag, pero kinasingkasing ug maayo iyang intention para makatabang spread sa gospel.

Kung ang usa ka leader tinuod na pangwarta ray gihunahuna, katong imong giingong reaction nga kung pwede lang hagkan ang nihatag, iya jud tong buhaton.heheh.

Walay problema kay tawhanon raman ta, pero ang issue is the unfair treatment sa kaning klase nga leaders.

thnx @brendomar at least you see my point..

@noy:

ingon ka dili ni related sa ako concern:
(I think NOT. Mao na nuon ni ako basis sir @noy why leaders does unfair treatment compare to the ordinary donors/members). Kani nga pagtulon-an.

"Dili ang amount/value nga imo gi-donate ang ma ihap sa Ginoo, kung dili ang kinasingkasing nga paghalad Kaniya."

Mao ngita ko clarification or information nga targeting for specific on religious leaders ky dili ko ma confuse if ordinary person ra ato basihan.

Hinuon tawo raman gyud ni cla pero they should be acting using God's words.
Hopefully you will not say they are still human kay medyo mao sd ni nga rason gamiton sa mga leader everytime masayop cla. "Kay tawo ramn pud ko"... so ang ending if kani nga rason, wala nay istoryahan pa..


Again, they call it a "Call" not a "profession".
For this argument sake let me take verses from:
Matthew 19:21
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

Luke 18:22
When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

ingon pa ni @DeathFox :
"the Pope lives like a King and the bishops live like royalty."

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kung walay organized religion, dugay rang na-expire na inyung jesus christ..

mao bitaw required mo mo-ampo og mo-adto mo sa simbahan taga sunday para di mo makalimot sa inyung jesus..

ayaw og simba or ampo for 5 years then basa og science books di ba mahimo mong atheist

Dili gyud ni issue about religion bro.. It is how leaders do preaching ang acted on their teachings.

[brendomar]

@crono+death ward

kung walay organized religion, dugay rang na-expire na inyung jesus christ..
mao bitaw required mo mo-ampo og mo-adto mo sa simbahan taga sunday para di mo makalimot sa inyung jesus..
ayaw og simba or ampo for 5 years then basa og science books di ba mahimo mong atheist

wala mankay saktong logic migo.
Think about this kuno. Compare Jesus Christ (a man of sorrow) against sa imong greatest Atheist leader (scientist,etc) and see kung kinsay daghang followers nila. Jesus never wrote a single book and had no educational attainment, yet he has the power to raise the dead. Imong atheist frend napuno ug philosophy ang utok but cannot help even himself kung masakit like cancer.

You dont have any idea migo that the power who sustains the church (believers) is the Holy Spirit of God!
Bisan unsa panang klaseha sa philosophy maabtan sa taw, when he realized that he is weak,fable, worthless and one day will appear before the Almighty God, his soul will surely embrace the love of Christ and his teachings.

Walay taw nga molahutay ug tuon/pakitag interest anang inyong atheism when from the start palang dili na uyon sa iyang konsensya and mga teachings.

An honest atheist migo once makasabot about the gospel and salvation of Jesus Christ mauwaw sa iyang kaugalingon ug dili magpagahi. Idk if you understand the gospel.

[noy]

@noy


Sal-ot lang ko gamay noy

Kung tawhanon nga pagkasulti uyon ko ani. Pero depende ni sya kay naay cases nga kaning klase sa reaction nga magdepende sa amount gihatag are for those Leaders nga Carnal, Materialistic tingali (sorry for the word). But for a spiritual leader (Priest,Pastor) whose eyes is set on the things of God, ang intention ug kasing2 sa naghatag maoy importante para niya. Sa bagay Ginoo ray nakabalo how sincere ang paghatag.
Naa man gud usahay kaning wealthy nga mga taw with their ego and pride kwarta ray palihokon, thinking acceptable na sa Ginoo ilang amount gihatag diay sinsiyo ra sa ilang income. Naa pud ultimo ug uyamot nga taw like sa poor widow nga bisan wala nay pangpalit sud-an unya 5pesos ray iyang nahatag, pero kinasingkasing ug maayo iyang intention para makatabang spread sa gospel.

Kung ang usa ka leader tinuod na pangwarta ray gihunahuna, katong imong giingong reaction nga kung pwede lang hagkan ang nihatag, iya jud tong buhaton.heheh.

Walay problema kay tawhanon raman ta, pero ang issue is the unfair treatment sa kaning klase nga leaders.

akong i mention si @rafee para mabasa pud ni nimu bai..

as religious leaders, their eyes may have been set on religious things but they are still bound with the physical limitations. that's the reality of our humanity..
one of such limitations would be seeing another person's heart..the priest/pastor cannot see the intention of the giver, despite of their role in the church..human as they are..di na kalikayan nga mas malipay jud sa mas dako nga gihatag..but this doesn't automatically and necessarily mean unfair treatment.. it means that they too are human beings like you and me..again, this is not an excuse rather it is a reality.

now, if there is really an unfair treatment going on..for example a pastor/priest would intentionally favor the ones who gave bigger donations tungod kay iyang hok-hokan in the future for personal gain or for whatever greedy and lustful intentions he may have..
we should let God decide anang dapita...that part is no longer our task..di man pud ta kita sa ilang kasing-kasing brad..

let me put it this way...

supposed there are 2 priests who both preached about the value of offerings that "it is not the amount that counts but the thought or the intention"..now, suppose we can see the heart of these priests..(as if mura kunohay ta ug Ginoo...enabling us to execute fair judgment..)

now imagine there are 2 donors..one is a poor fellow who gave only p20,iyang gihatag sa duha ka pari..
Priest 1: salamat kaayo dong..God bless you more..i pray the Lord bless you for your kind heart (kita kunohay ta sa iyang kasing-kasing, makita nato nga mapasalamaton jud siya sa p20).
Priest 2:salamat kaayo dong..God bless you more..i pray the Lord bless you for your kind heart (ang naa sa kasing-kasing kay sus! personal pa ug hatag..p20 ra diay..gihulog nalang unta to sa sibot..hasula! Lol )

here comes the 2nd donor..
a very rich businessman, donated 1M for "whatever" purpose it may serve...
Priest 1: murag nakadaog ug lotto..gi announce sa tibuok parokya nga naay ning donate ug 1M..special mention pa ang name sa business man..(kita ta sa iyang heart..nalipay lang jud siya! as in genuinely nalipay jud...iyang huna-huna makapa renovate na sa orphanage...madayun na jud ang dugay ra nga gihandom nga medical ug dental mission..feeding para sa mga kabos nga igsoon kang Kristo..ug uban pa...mao perting lipaya niya)
Priest 2: murag nakadaog ug lotto..gi announce sa tibuok parokya nga naay ning donate ug 1M..special mention pa ang name sa business man..(ang naa sa heart: ako jud ning abi-abihon ug maayo kay in case naa na puy project puhon especially if maka korakot ko! prehas ani karon..1M akong ihatag ani kay 500K ra..pila ra bay pag ingun nga akong gi donate sa mga naay cancer ang other 500K..wahahahahahahaha!--evil laugh)...

Now, tell me...are they really the same? both are priests..both eyes are or should be set on heavenly things..and at the same time, still human beings..

mao nay akong punto brader.. kita nga wala kakita sa kasing-kasing sa priest or pastor perting dalia ra nato maka ingun nga tawhanon kaayo nga reaction..materialistic kaayo ning paria or kini nga pastor...

ang pangutana, kahibaw ta sa rason ngano perting lipaya niya?
Ginoo ray nahibaw..therefore, Ginoo ra say mag-igo..

[brendomar]

hahahah, nalingaw ko sa reaction sa priest 2 sa 20pesos noy.

bitaw, nindot ni kung ang reaction positive regardless sa amount unya gamiton pud unta sa insakto para sa tumong sa ministry.

[<SMILE>]

thnx @brendomar at least you see my point..

@noy:

ingon ka dili ni related sa ako concern:
(I think NOT. Mao na nuon ni ako basis sir @noy why leaders does unfair treatment compare to the ordinary donors/members). Kani nga pagtulon-an.

"Dili ang amount/value nga imo gi-donate ang ma ihap sa Ginoo, kung dili ang kinasingkasing nga paghalad Kaniya."

Mao ngita ko clarification or information nga targeting for specific on religious leaders ky dili ko ma confuse if ordinary person ra ato basihan.

Hinuon tawo raman gyud ni cla pero they should be acting using God's words.
Hopefully you will not say they are still human kay medyo mao sd ni nga rason gamiton sa mga leader everytime masayop cla. "Kay tawo ramn pud ko"... so ang ending if kani nga rason, wala nay istoryahan pa..


Again, they call it a "Call" not a "profession".
For this argument sake let me take verses from:
Matthew 19:21
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

Luke 18:22
When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

ingon pa ni @DeathFox :
"the Pope lives like a King and the bishops live like royalty."

- - - Updated - - -



Dili gyud ni issue about religion bro.. It is how leaders do preaching ang acted on their teachings.

John 18:36-37
36 Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place.”
37 “You are a king, then!” said Pilate.

Jesus answered, “You say that I am a king. In fact, the reason I was born and came into the world is to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me.”

[noy]

thnx @brendomar at least you see my point..

@noy:

ingon ka dili ni related sa ako concern:
(I think NOT. Mao na nuon ni ako basis sir @noy why leaders does unfair treatment compare to the ordinary donors/members). Kani nga pagtulon-an.

"Dili ang amount/value nga imo gi-donate ang ma ihap sa Ginoo, kung dili ang kinasingkasing nga paghalad Kaniya."

Mao ngita ko clarification or information nga targeting for specific on religious leaders ky dili ko ma confuse if ordinary person ra ato basihan.

Hinuon tawo raman gyud ni cla pero they should be acting using God's words.
Hopefully you will not say they are still human kay medyo mao sd ni nga rason gamiton sa mga leader everytime masayop cla. "Kay tawo ramn pud ko"... so ang ending if kani nga rason, wala nay istoryahan pa..
.

bai, mao bitaw nangutana ko sa imu...iis it really unfair if ang reaction sa gihatagan magdepende sa gihatag? i would like to your answer usa before we move forward.

mao ning explain ko nga the only time a priest/pastor goes against this sort of teaching is when they would refuse to accept an offering with the amount as the reason of refusal.. that teaching does not at all point out to how we should react when given something..

Priest or not we believe that it's the thought over value that counts..
tungod kay mutuo ta ani..we preach it either to others and to ourselves...
whenever mu agree ta sa usa ka thought..we are already preaching that to ourselves...supposed nga unfair jud nga magdepende ang reaction sa gihatag..aw, di lang ang pari/pastor ang mga hipokrito..kita tanan! as in kitang tanan nga tao...

Again, they call it a "Call" not a "profession".
For this argument sake let me take verses from:
Matthew 19:21
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

the possessions of these leaders are not their own..they are of the Church.. except for the things that are given to them personally by other people...
mao bitawng ming biya ning mga tawhana sa ilang pamilya nga naka dak-an..mao bitawng wala magminyo ang pari..and mao ning rasona nga bisan asa ni sila ma assign...mao bitawng ang uban ma putlan ug liog tungod sa ilang "call" because they held no reservations...

that verse does not apply to everyone bai, it only applies to those people who wants to follow God but are held back with reservations be it wealth, relationships or whatever..who are these people? i don't know..only God knows...
Jesus knew nga kadtong iyang gisultihan ana...ingun ato to siya nga klase nga tao..
so ang gitubag ni Jesus: ibaligya na tanang butang..ug sunod nako..
diba unsay resulta? nag guol ang tao...because iyang gipakadak-an ang iyang bahandi...Jesus knew...pero kita we don't...
only God can point out to whom specifically that verse applies...
i hope you see my point..

ingon pa ni @DeathFox :
"the Pope lives like a King and the bishops live like royalty.".

bai, i'd like to share a Q and A with similar thoughts from Catholic Answers

Full Question: When we think of Jesus, a humble man comes to mind. But when we think of the pope what comes to mind is a man wearing custom clothing, sitting on the papal throne, with people kissing his ring. Why is there such disparity between Christ and his vicar?

Answer: When an ambassador is representing his country abroad, should he wear a T-shirt and jeans or formal attire? When taking part in official diplomatic ceremonies, are the marks of honor given the ambassador by his host country for him personally or for the country he represents? In like manner, the pope is the primary ambassador for Christ and for the heavenly kingdom. Formal attire honors the dignity of his office and the Person he represents. Marks of honor given the pope are not for him personally but for Jesus, who he represents.

Dili gyud ni issue about religion bro.. It is how leaders do preaching ang acted on their teachings.

there you go.. so it's about the leaders then..

question though, are we certain that these leaders we speak of are who we really think they are(hypocrites)?
or that is what our minds perceived..

bottom line is, unless we have a solid and absolute proof(meaning di jud malalis) that they really are, we might as well lift them up to God in prayer as well us ourselves for enlightenment on how to deal with these things instead of calling them hypocrites outrightly..
i think this is what a Chrisitan should do..otherwise, we might end up hating these people..these people like us whom which Christ loved and died for..

[crono+death ward]

Think about this kuno. Compare Jesus Christ (a man of sorrow) against sa imong greatest Atheist leader

akong hero kay si superman kay dili man siya mangsunog og mga haters niya sa impyerno.

unya mas kusgan pa si superman kaysa kang jesus... si jesus di kapildi og mga powerless nga mga romans

superman - 1
jesus - 0

[noy]

hahahah, nalingaw ko sa reaction sa priest 2 sa 20pesos noy.

bitaw, nindot ni kung ang reaction positive regardless sa amount unya gamiton pud unta sa insakto para sa tumong sa ministry.

positive man jud na brad, di lang prehas ug level...tagaan taka ug piso? magpasalamat ka pero dili ka mag lukso2x sa kalipay..
pero tagaan takag 20K..basin hagkan pa ko nimu..LOL

of course, angay jud na idapat sa angay padulngan tanang donasyon..pero kung iliko ug asa dapit aw..ang labing makagagahom nalang unyay mag-igo ana...siguradoon lang jud sa mga korakot nga di nato masakpan...kay may purohan nga mapapriso pa..

[rafee]

You honestly made my day sir @noy .. Lisod usahay pasabton ang dili mosabot like me.. .. bitw, I'm not giving any reason just to prove that I am right.

Murag everytime mo read ko sa imo comment mo flash back dayon how I started to hate these leaders because of your answers. Why? (I'm not questioning the way you answer my queries but I'm just wondering even though I understand.. its just me who can't accept it. Weird but that is the truth.) Sobra rba ako hatred?

and to answer your question: is it really unfair if ang reaction sa gihatagan magdepende sa gihatag?
(If this is NOT talking about personal reaction) For me yes. It is unfair for they chose to follow God but this struck me a bit "supposed nga unfair jud nga magdepende ang reaction sa gihatag..aw, di lang ang pari/pastor ang mga hipokrito..kita tanan! as in kitang tanan nga tao..."..... This is true..I agree.
and I ended up nothing to ask. I mean wala nako question ky mostly imo na gitubag,..pero feel nko dili tanan natubag but now wondering: if dili tanan natubag, wla na sd ko kahibaw ug unsa na nga mga questions/confusions ang WALA pa natubag nimo..
Seems like still looking for answers without questions .. sorry..
makalibog na nuon but thats how I feel for now..