'We tried to contact each other' - captains from both ships that collided.

[AmpaoCity]

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It appears that the port authority lacks the interest to place sophisticated tools to govern vessels coming in and out of the port because, in the past, wala mai incident nahitabo na collision as what happened between 2GO and Sulpicio na nikalas jud ug pi.pila na kinabuhi.

I think duna na proposal before to have some sort of traffic control center to manage the vessels floating with the port area. But, for some reason, it didn't came to fruition. There is a terminology ani but kalimot ko. Daghan na ang nagmention ani diri na thread.

The basic like sa TSS (Traffic Separation Scheme) naay Controller wherein whatever these vsl do mamonitor sa tanang barko sa palibot. Hopefully after the blaming part, preventive safety solution of some sort may come, hopefully.

[mang kulas]

so pila na ka kina buhi ang na wla pro wla p gd ko ka dung-gog nga naa gi priso nga captain labi na naa shipping company gi kuha-an ug license to operate....... when man diay n cla mo learn sa ela lesson , unsa mag huwat p cla nga ela pd pamilya ang ma unay aning hitabo-a.....hurot nlng gd ako bilid aning suplicio pila na ka kinabuhi ela g hatod maypa mag negosyo pd ni cla ug funeral parlor.... btw mayta naa n action ani gd dli lng ni malimtan.....

Naa na daghan bro, ambot lng sa pilipinas ug naa na,,, sa australia ug mag oil spill ka, ma preso ka, way dagahn pangutana... asta sa US ug EUROPE

[godwhacker]

dakug posibilidad nga negligence ni sa kapitan sa cargo ship. sigun sa initial investigation, imbis channel 16 ang standard nga communications gibalhin sa channel 12 kay dunay interference, pag pananghid sa trans asia nga mo overtake. most probably nakalimot ang cargo ship nga channel 12 gihapon sila samtang nagsige ug radyo ang 2go sa channel 16. miangkon ang kapitan sa cargo ship nga ila gibalik sa channel 16 pero ang kapitan sa trans asia sigun sa iyang testemonia, nakadungog sila ug mayday sa radio. and most probably this is on channel 12. so mao nga di gyud diay sila magka kontakay ang duha ka kapitan. despite the availability of technology, naa lang jud gihapon ma simyat.

[vo2max]

Akong mga pangutana basi sa 1st day imbestigasyon as reported online sa The Freeman

Basta miron daghan makita. (look at a chess game mas daghan pa makita ang mga miron).
But since this is a forum everyone is free to ask questions and voice out their opinions.

Without prejudice sa ongoing inquest proceeding, a lot can be had on the testimony of the witnesses.
- 2GO cruising speed was 15 kts - is this the vessel's full maneuvering speed or full sea speed? is this considered a safe speed approaching a channel nga sila na gyud nagingon masikip. Can your engine slow down in time?
- Capt. of Transasia 9 admitted that most captains prefer to use the inbound lane when proceeding to sea and Sulpicio Ex7 used the inbound lane. - is it allowed by the rules for Sulpicio7 to proceed to the wrong lane for his normal outbound route?
Sa "bible" refer @mang kulas. Accdg to Rule 10 a vessel using the traffic separation scheme shall (i) proceed in the appropriate traffic lane in the general direction of traffic flow for that lane; (ii) so far as practicable keep clear of a traffic separation line or separation zone.

Additionally;
quote...
Bermejo (2GO capt) said he tried to contact the other ship through channel 16 but there was no answer. His ship was travelling at around 15 knots and was a mile away from the Sulpicio Express.
Four minutes before the collision, Bermejo said it was only then that they saw the red light from Sulpicio Express which led him to immediately turn to hard port or left side.
The red light is a sign for a ship to turn right while green signals left.
Upon shifting to the port side, Bermejo said he then attempted to turn right to avoid the collision.
unquote...

Radio Communication - assuming 2Go master was correctly quoted by the reporter, is it prudent to try to communicate with the other vessel when she was running at 15 kts at a range of 1 nmile from the other vessel? When does a master consider a situation a CLOSE QUARTER situation?
The Sulpicio master alleged that he was also calling the 2GO vessel but did not hear any answer.

Are both masters relying on RADIO COMMUNICATION AS COLLISION AVOIDANCE at this particular close quarters situation. Are there no unwritten code where a vessel should execute avoidance action when they reached a particular distance and the other vessel is not taking any action? At what point does communication ends and positive collision avoidance begins?

Why would Sulpicio7 use the inbound lane? Can he not use his designated outbound lane safely? Did he not see the inbound 2GO vessel? Unsa naay issue sa iyang barko. Seabed to ship bottom clearance (underkeel clearance) gamay ra? Perhaps short cutting route kay duol nalang alteration padung Manila?

Naa ba ni sila mga plan sama sa eroplano nga naa flight plan? Like passage planning?

Naa bay mga evidences ani nga makuha ang SBMI sa kada usa nila? Mapa para makita ang ilang mga positions, Mapa sa TransAsia nga makapamatuod sa position sa Sulpicio (kay nagovertake man siya). Urine samples, Alcohol test, Drug test atong time human pagkahitabua?

Ngano man ang driver sa mini-bus nga nahagbong sa Pardo gi-detain man ug kaning duwa wala man?

My apologies for this long post. Naglibog lang akong ulo ug nangita kog mga katubagan.

[mang kulas]

Akong mga pangutana basi sa 1st day imbestigasyon as reported online sa The Freeman

Basta miron daghan makita. (look at a chess game mas daghan pa makita ang mga miron).
But since this is a forum everyone is free to ask questions and voice out their opinions.

Without prejudice sa ongoing inquest proceeding, a lot can be had on the testimony of the witnesses.
- 2GO cruising speed was 15 kts - is this the vessel's full maneuvering speed or full sea speed? is this considered a safe speed approaching a channel nga sila na gyud nagingon masikip. Can your engine slow down in time?
- Capt. of Transasia 9 admitted that most captains prefer to use the inbound lane when proceeding to sea and Sulpicio Ex7 used the inbound lane. - is it allowed by the rules for Sulpicio7 to proceed to the wrong lane for his normal outbound route?
Sa "bible" refer @mang kulas. Accdg to Rule 10 a vessel using the traffic separation scheme shall (i) proceed in the appropriate traffic lane in the general direction of traffic flow for that lane; (ii) so far as practicable keep clear of a traffic separation line or separation zone.

Additionally;
quote...
Bermejo (2GO capt) said he tried to contact the other ship through channel 16 but there was no answer. His ship was travelling at around 15 knots and was a mile away from the Sulpicio Express.
Four minutes before the collision, Bermejo said it was only then that they saw the red light from Sulpicio Express which led him to immediately turn to hard port or left side.
The red light is a sign for a ship to turn right while green signals left.
Upon shifting to the port side, Bermejo said he then attempted to turn right to avoid the collision.
unquote...

Radio Communication - assuming 2Go master was correctly quoted by the reporter, is it prudent to try to communicate with the other vessel when she was running at 15 kts at a range of 1 nmile from the other vessel? When does a master consider a situation a CLOSE QUARTER situation?
The Sulpicio master alleged that he was also calling the 2GO vessel but did not hear any answer.

Are both masters relying on RADIO COMMUNICATION AS COLLISION AVOIDANCE at this particular close quarters situation. Are there no unwritten code where a vessel should execute avoidance action when they reached a particular distance and the other vessel is not taking any action? At what point does communication ends and positive collision avoidance begins?

Why would Sulpicio7 use the inbound lane? Can he not use his designated outbound lane safely? Did he not see the inbound 2GO vessel? Unsa naay issue sa iyang barko. Seabed to ship bottom clearance (underkeel clearance) gamay ra? Perhaps short cutting route kay duol nalang alteration padung Manila?

Naa ba ni sila mga plan sama sa eroplano nga naa flight plan? Like passage planning?

Naa bay mga evidences ani nga makuha ang SBMI sa kada usa nila? Mapa para makita ang ilang mga positions, Mapa sa TransAsia nga makapamatuod sa position sa Sulpicio (kay nagovertake man siya). Urine samples, Alcohol test, Drug test atong time human pagkahitabua?

Ngano man ang driver sa mini-bus nga nahagbong sa Pardo gi-detain man ug kaning duwa wala man?

My apologies for this long post. Naglibog lang akong ulo ug nangita kog mga katubagan.

15 knots? kusog rana kaayu na. sa ingon ana ka narrow na channel
wala diay ma detain ang 2 ka CAPTAIN?
naa man juy passage plan bay, ug naa jud dapat position sa chart every 10 or 15 mins. kung chaneling, kung mahimu 5 mins. teg 1 hr na pag open sea... pero dili nlng sad pag discriminate usab sa mga taga interisland kay naa nasay masuko diri, unya ma infraction nasad ta. LAHI!!!!! ra jud kaayu ang pratice compara sa intl.... alcohol test? dris interisland? ambot lng...
kabaw ka PAUGATAY dris atoa, kung kinsay mahadlok, xay unag likay...
its all about attitude jud towrds the job.

[vo2max]

15 knots? kusog rana kaayu na. sa ingon ana ka narrow na channel
wala diay ma detain ang 2 ka CAPTAIN?
naa man juy passage plan bay, ug naa jud dapat position sa chart every 10 or 15 mins. kung chaneling, kung mahimu 5 mins. teg 1 hr na pag open sea... pero dili nlng sad pag discriminate usab sa mga taga interisland kay naa nasay masuko diri, unya ma infraction nasad ta. LAHI!!!!! ra jud kaayu ang pratice compara sa intl.... alcohol test? dris interisland? ambot lng...
kabaw ka PAUGATAY dris atoa, kung kinsay mahadlok, xay unag likay...
its all about attitude jud towrds the job.

Aw kusog diay nang 15 kts (27.8 kph)?
Unsang speed diay imo ikarekomenda under the prevailing circumstances?
Unsa kahay salida/"turning circle" aning barkoha sa 15kts with 1 nmile distance sa usa ka barko? Imong estimate lang @mang kulas mga pila kaha.

Mas dakong pangutana tingali ngano ang Sulpicio tua man sa inbound lane noh.
Dili ba murag sa highway nga misugat sa main traffic flow ang Sulpicio?

Tan-aw nako, without prejudice, murag silang duwa gyud ang wala gasunod sa "bible".
Ug katong radio-radio mao gyud to akong duda.

OT: Sa U.S. kaning mga cases related sa collisions ug marine pollution one on one man ang investigation sa kada witnesses. Unya nalang tahion sumpay sumpay ining mahuman na ang tanan witnesses. Pero if ingana na diri sa atoa samot ug kalibog ang SBMI noh.

[janhenz1]

15 knots? kusog rana kaayu na. sa ingon ana ka narrow na channel
.

huh? ever heard of minimum bare steerage speed?
wala cguro ka kasakay ug mga barko nga kun mag 8 knots below dili na ma-steady ang heading.
Ang maneuvering speed sa akong mga barko nga mga nasakyan is 14 knots man at 40RPM

So 15 knots kusug na kaayo on a narrow channel?
parehas man gyud ta wala nkasakay ug inter-island then perhaps nakabiyahe
naka sa mga inland waters sa America say Savannah River on a container ship perhaps?
Wala ka kasab-i sa Pilot ug nangayo nalang siya ug additional RPM if your vessel can't provide the 14 knots he requested sa maneuvering full.

15 knots kusug ra kaayo on narrow channel?
nakabiyahe ka sa Ningbo where currents can go as strong as 9 knots?

15 knots kusug ra kaayo on a narrow channel?
Nakabiyahi ka sa Ho Chi Minh?
The approach is narrow as narrow can get.
If wala paka naka biyahe sa Ho Chi Minh or kita sa charts diha,
I'll be happy to provide you a screenshot from my Transas Chart Collection.
(dili na nimo makita sa OPenCpn CM 93v2 charts).
Wala ka kuyapi pag-ingon sa Pilot to go full sea speed - full sea speed on a very narrow river (edit: and parang bituka ng manok as an AB described it) on a container ship at that?

I can go on but anyway ang akong punto is nganong naka-ingon man ka nga 15 knots is kusug ra kaayo on a narrow channel?
Pilot ka? If you are, then i must relent and crawl back under my rock.
Pero i doubt nga Pilot ka or an officer-of-the watch at the very least.
Kay if you have stand watch maski 4 hours lang samtang ang imong barko is navigating on a "narrow channel"
you should have known nga "safe speed" on a narrow channel is relative.
Daghan factors involved, some of which i've already mentioned - minimum bare steerage speed, current and Pilot's discretion.
Needless to say there are vessels that must maintain an ideal safe speed of 15 knots in a narrow channel
ang mo slow down lang where there are very shallow areas to reduce the squat.

I can go on discussing squat if you like

[sizzlingROBOT]

One reason why 2GO traveled at 15 knots because it's going against the sea current. I know the water in that strait runs from north to south. If it traveled below that speed, it might have difficulty controlling the ship and it might drift to shallow water.

[vo2max]

@janhenz1 @mang kulas

We have heard your opinions. And being that kamo naay mga experience diri sa atong forum, we gladly appreciate your insights which will give us more ideas of what really transpired.
You can voice out your opinions pero suggest nako let's do it in a civil way nga walay ma-offend sa atong post.
Basig kamo noon duwa ang magkabanggaanay diri.

Life's getting a bit interesting now huh?
Opinions we need from the master's and others with experience in the marine industry.
Also let's us not look down on the inter-island officers. Remember that they are also professionals like your goodselves is. We have high regards to them, in the same manner as we have to you our foreign-trading officers. Remember 7001 Islands and they are the ones connecting these islands as common carriers. In the same manner as you OWF seamen bring us the $$$'s.

I'm not a MOD and i'm not trying to be.
Gi-anticipate lang nako nga dili ni maglead sa "close-quarters situation" diri. No pun intended .

[vo2max]

One reason why 2GO traveled at 15 knots because it's going against the sea current. I know the water in that strait runs from north to south. If it traveled below that speed, it might have difficulty controlling the ship and it might drift to shallow water.

Ah okay so current mao ang likely reason sa speed nga 15kts.

Pero regardless if 15kts or not manuevering speed na ba ni siya? By maneuvering speed ako pasabot mas dali maglower ug rpm compare sa sea speed?

So the current is North to South padung taob.
Atong time of collision padung taob man to siya (obserba nako kay gafishing mi ato nga time sa pier ug sige pa saka ang water level).