Atheism

[chipper_buy]

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i do believe in Him all the time.. though sometimes, i tend to argue myself.

what are those arguments u have with GOD?

[kim071316]

on why He made some things that way (for me).. which is harder compared to others'..

[chipper_buy]

on why He made some things that way (for me).. which is harder compared to others'..

on my opinion don't get mad ok?!..

u shouldn't ask GOD WHY instead YOU thank HIM for letting u go through that situation or problem.

Coz it clearly show's that HE acknowledge YOU as a person living in this world who can make a difference.

In this world we all our ups in down in life. We simply just accept what we all face even today..make the most of it while were still alive.

Ask urself these.. after everything what u've been thru HOW ARE U RIGHT NOW?...

If ur a much better person today then u did ryt in the person. if ur not U can still do something about it ryt now.

[kim071316]

^hmm.. hehe. thanks.. you made me feel better now

[aim_501]

it doesn't matter if you believe GOD or not but what really important is one's attitude! THere are many believers that commit mistakes more...

[SPRINGFIELD_XD_40]

To all of our RESIDENT ATHEIST ... it may be an old issue / topic / Catholic belief but what are your takes on the 5 PROOFS of the EXISTENCE of GOD by St. THOMAS AQUINAS ?

1.ex motu ( argument unmoved mover )
2.ex causa ( argument of first cause )
3.ex contingentia (argument of contingency )
4.ex gradu ( argument of degree )
5.ex fine ( argument of design )

[gareb]

SPRINGFIELD_XD_40:

you should have stated what these argument really said at the first place. it's easy for those who know what these things are, but might repel anybody who might have encountered these terms here for the first time.

it's pretty easy to look for precisely why St. Thomas Aquinas' arguments cannot hold by searching the net, but i'll indulge you and answer your query anyway. but i leave you to dig for the finer details yourself.



essentially, ex motu, ex causa and ex contingentia are different versions of the cosmological argument (first cause argument in layman's terms) which presupposes the existence of a 'prime mover' or 'first cause' of everything that the universe contains. the problem with this is that it questionably construes the argument in such a way that a first cause 'is not caused by anything'. we of course ask why the exemption. another simple objection to the argument is physics. 'cause' in physics requires the element of 'time' which is merely a property of the universe. this means that 'causality' cannot exist prior to time.

the argument of contingency is best refuted by letting the affirmative, if he/she can, demonstrate contingency; a 'something' and a 'nothing'. the former is easy to demonstrate. the latter is actually harder than it looks and may even be impossible to do.

ex gradu is a form of ontological argument, where it is insisted that there is a being that possesses perfection (perfect good, perfect bliss, perfect evil) since we have a concept of perfection but cannot see it in anything here on earth. the problem with this is that all these properties contradict themselves if indeed they are in one being. to pull one back into reality, it does not necessarily follow that if one has an idea of perfection, that perfection automatically exists somewhere.

nobody is at odds with the basic premises of ex fine, or the argument of design. what is faulty is that it insists that with a design, comes an 'intelligent designer' (supposedly God) instead of an impersonal force like 'nature' for example. this is adding up an irrelevant material to the argument which is sound without it. of course there is the question of "who designed the 'intelligent designer'", but aside from that, it grossly oversimplifies and glosses over certain basic realities of this universe. imperfection and suffering is clearly present, some things that are at odds with a supposedly 'perfect designer'.

[SPRINGFIELD_XD_40]

SPRINGFIELD_XD_40:

you should have stated what these argument really said at the first place. it's easy for those who know what these things are, but might repel anybody who might have encountered these terms here for the first time.

Right , I should have but then I am one of those people who dont understand it either though its not the first time I encountered and bumped to it , just came across with lang and remembered about the topic " ATHEIST " thats why I asked whats the your take and the rest of the iSTORYAN ATHEIST'S .

it's pretty easy to look for precisely why St. Thomas Aquinas' arguments cannot hold by searching the net, but i'll indulge you and answer your query anyway. but i leave you to dig for the finer details yourself.

I'm scared I cant do that . I based my beliefs on FAITH , not on ARGUING , PRESENTING and DEBATING to prove something . Indeed your take was well taken , valued and respected .

Thanks for your participation ... it did gave me an idea on an open mind's point of view .

[gareb]

SPRINGFIELD_XD_40:

i don't have any problems either with people who have different beliefs other than mine even if i am surrounded by them , though it can be quite a hassle when me being the odd man out gets to be branded in terms i could only describe as something that can come out of sheer misinformation.

i too profess faith, contrary to popular belief. but my faith on one thing comes after a process of substantiation; in this case 'existence' and then 'significance'. i apply this brand of 'screening' to everything; may it be theoretical science, political issues, personal convictions, and even people.

[silent-kill]

most reasonable people I've talked to are atheists, because they Listen and think for a while before they argue.

though i believe in a creator you may call him "god" or the "SUM total Energy of the universe" but it doesn't matter. i believe in random events, and not on predestine fate.

what stops me from believing a "god" from any religion is the concept of "good and evil" the "reward system" the "punishment system", and the politics involve to get you in.

am i atheists? i donno, am i sinning against god? i donno, but if god is conscious and looking at me now I'm sure he will understand me cause I'm using his "gift" and that is to think for myself.