Are we saved by faith alone, or do we need works, too?

[rics zalved]

Peter is an example of a true disciple, bisan ug nafall siya pero nirepent sya, though nafall siya ato, wala man nalose iyang salvation

si David though na fall pud, gidisplina ra siya sa Ginoo ato, pero wala nalose iya salvation

si Solomon pud though nafall, nirepent na pud, God was patient sa iyaha kay maybe kabalo siya morepent jud siya, iyaha gud nang Proverbs ug Ecclesiastes, God assigns authors of the Bible that are truly believers

si Saul questionable iya salvation, if he really a believer kay murag nablinded man dayon siya sa iyang power after sa mga blessings, though God only knows if he really is saved.

pero sa old testament times naa pay come and go ang Holy Spirit kaniadto unlike today nga sealed na, mao nga nihawa ang Holy Spirit kang Saul ug nahadlok pud si David nga mohawa pud ang Holy Spirit niya kadto nakasala siya

2 peter 2:21 verse refers to apostasy sad siya like sa Hebrews verse

if someone falls, ang relationship with God is naay tampohan temporarily, just like a Father and child relationship, makatikaw jud ug disiplina pero anak gihapon ka ug walay makausab ana, pero if we confess to God, he is faithful and just to forgive, just like a Father and Son relationship, automatic jud na ang forgiveness because we are sons and fathers loves his sons and relationship will be healthy again

[MavsMan]

Peter is an example of a true disciple, bisan ug nafall siya pero nirepent sya, though nafall siya ato, wala man nalose iyang salvation

si David though na fall pud, gidisplina ra siya sa Ginoo ato, pero wala nalose iya salvation

si Solomon pud though nafall, nirepent na pud, God was patient sa iyaha kay maybe kabalo siya morepent jud siya, iyaha gud nang Proverbs ug Ecclesiastes, God assigns authors of the Bible that are truly believers

si Saul questionable iya salvation, if he really accepted Jesus kay murag nablinded man dayon siya sa iyang power after sa mga blessings, though God only knows if he really is saved.

pero sa old testament times naa pay come and go ang Holy Spirit kaniadto unlike today nga sealed na, mao nga nihawa ang Holy Spirit kang Saul ug nahadlok pud si David nga mohawa pud ang Holy Spirit niya kadto nakasala siya

2 peter 2:21 verse refers to apostasy sad siya like sa Hebrews verse

if someone falls, ang relationship with God is naay tampohan temporarily, just like a Father and child relationship, makatikaw jud ug disiplina pero anak gihapon ka ug walay makausab ana, pero if we confess to God, he is faithful just like a Father and Son relationship, automatic jud na ang forgiveness because we are sons and Fathers loves His son

When Peter denied Jesus so then Jesus denied Peter to the father. ana lang.. If namatay si Peter without repenting, then eternal damnation iya maabtan.

and a seal can be broken as explained here Sealed UNTO the day of redemption, but a seal can be broken Eph. 4:30 | Bjorkbloggen .

And the text does not say ”UNTIL” the day of redemption. It says UNTO, and apart from ”unto” it can mean ”FOR”.

[rics zalved]

regarding on Peter's denial....

Eternal security Bible study - questions on difficult verses

Question 1: What does ‘falling away’ or ‘turning away’ mean to a saved person?

In looking up these verses again, I found it interesting that the term 'fall away' was used by the Lord Jesus of His 11 disciples at the time of His arrest. The disciples deserted Jesus as was predicted and Peter obviously denied Jesus three times. This was said to be a 'falling away'. (see Matt 26:31-35) Obviously, this is not a loss of salvation. For the true believer it may involve a temporary period of backsliding or time of being out of fellowship with God. It is times when for one reason or another, the believer is having difficulty in his Christian walk. The believer would not however deny what they believe in their heart, even though their walk would not match what they believe. But note that even though Jesus said they would 'fall away', in the very same context, he also said to Peter that he had prayed that his faith would not fail and when he returned, to strengthen his brethren. (Luke 22:32) In other words, true believers may fall at times but their faith does not fail because Jesus intercedes for them. Concerning this intercession we are told 'hence, also, He is able to save forever those who draw near to God through Him (true salvation), since He always lives to make intercession for them.' And when do true believers need Jesus' intercession more but when they are struggling? See also John 17:6-12 concerning this intercession by Jesus for His believers. In this ‘High Priestly’ prayer, Jesus makes it clear that the ones that God has given Him he keeps safe! See also Rom 8:32-34 where Jesus' intercession is used as one of the points to show that we cannot be separated from the love of Christ.

In contrast to this are several other passages which speak of apostasy. The first falling away is temporary and is in regard to their walk. For a true believer however, they will never deny their faith in the Lord Jesus. And, like the true prodigal son, they will return. Apostasy however, as mentioned in Heb 6:6 and 1 Tim 4:1 amongst other verses, speaks of a falling away from the faith - an abandonment of the faith and truth of the gospel. This is prophesied to increase greatly in the end times. As Heb 6:4-7 states this is done by those who very much look like they are genuine saved believers. They have known everything that is needed to be saved; they have felt the conviction and drawing of the Holy Spirit, maybe even seen other signs that enable them to make a genuine decision. They may even go along with Christian teaching for a while... but they become apostates... prodigal pigs who turn away from it all, deny the truth and go back to the mud.

Concerning apostasy (deliberately falling away and turning from the truth of the faith) William MacDonald writes in the Believers Bible Commentary - 'Apostasy is a sin which is only committed by unbelievers, not by those who are deceived, but by those who knowingly, and wilfully and maliciously turn from the truth... Apostasy should not be confused with backsliding. A true believer may wander very far from Christ. Through sin his fellowship with God is shattered. But he can be restored to full fellowship as he confesses and forsakes his sin.'

Titus 1:10-16 also talks of those that 'turn from the truth' calling them 'empty talkers and deceivers'... those who are 'defiled and unbelieving' and it says that they profess to know God but by their deeds they deny Him.' This is no sheep of God we are talking about here. More like a wolf!

regarding on Ezekiel verse

https://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bib...nd-ezekiel-18/

Q. My question is, how do you interpret Ezekiel 18:24 in the light of OSAS? I believe fully that the saved person can’t be lost, but wondered about this text. I have been greatly helped by your website, thank you very much.


A. Ezekiel 18:24 was written to Old Testament Israel and says, “But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness he is guilty of and because of the sins he has committed, he will die.”

The Church is the only group in the history of man to be promised Eternal Security. Even the post church believers who will go through the Great Tribulation are not given this assurance, but must be responsible for their own faithfulness (Rev. 14:12).

it agrees also on my thought that Old Testament period was a period when the Holy Sprit will come and go...

another interpretation pud ana is righteousness nga gikan sa ilang pagkaself righteous, crediting only their works to be righteous in front og God

Ezekiel 18:24 Explained

"But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die."

The best way to interpret the Bible is with the Bible! I've read so much heresy surrounding Ezekiel 18:24. As an example, the Congregational Holiness Church, the Wesleyan Holiness Movement, and the Charismatic Movement all misinterpret Ezekiel 18:24 to teach that a Christian can lose their salvation. Nothing could be further from the truth!

Oral Roberts and his family came from the Holiness Movement out of Oklahoma. He was a product that came from the Latter Rain Pentecostal Movement of the late 1940’s, and was a well known demonic faith healer. Taken by itself out of context, Ezekiel 18:24 does appear to support the doctrine that a man can fall away from salvation. However, as you will see from other Scriptures in Ezekiel, this is NOT the case at all.

Ezekiel 33:12-13 states ...

"Therefore, thou son of man, say unto the children of thy people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression: as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall thereby in the day that he turneth from his wickedness; neither shall the righteous be able to live for his righteousness in the day that he sinneth. When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if he trust to his OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it."

Did you read that? ... “If he trust in his OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS.” This is the heart of the matter here. God is simply condemning self-righteousness. The New Testament states in Romans 10:3-4 ...

“For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.”

[MavsMan]

Anyways, let's stop here.. kay wa jd tay padulngan. For me, i will no longer embrace the OSAS doctrine. Daghan ug verse na nag refute ana plus sa mga testimonies sa mga nka-experience ug vision about Hell and sa mga near-death experiences.

What's important is daily repentance and live a holy and righteous life.

By the way, mutoo ka bah nga hapit na ang rapture and this is the season? Like sa Shemita year na mahitabo krn September and sa last blood moon podm this september. Unsa mn imu opinion ana?

[rics zalved]

mao pud lagi kapuyan jud ko mga ingon ani kanang mga arguments though naa man sad koy nakat-onan pud , minor ra man sad kaayo ni difference pud bay as long nga ni walk by the spirit ta, it is up to God man pud kung gidawat ba jud nato siya heartily, anyways thank you sa mga inputs

about anang blood moon this coming September ug sa rapture this year, si God ra nahibaw gihapon, kung karong tuiga ok na lang pud para di na abtan ug election, modaug pa lang noon si Binay

[MavsMan]

mao pud lagi kapuyan jud ko mga ingon ani kanang mga arguments though naa man sad koy nakat-onan pud , minor ra man sad kaayo ni difference pud bay as long nga ni walk by the spirit ta, it is up to God man pud kung gidawat ba jud nato siya heartily, anyways thank you sa mga inputs

about anang blood moon this coming September ug sa rapture this year, si God ra nahibaw gihapon, kung karong tuiga ok na lang pud para di na abtan ug election, modaug pa lang noon si Binay

Mao.. salamat sad sa mga inputs nimu

Hahaha.. di diay pd ka ganahan ni binay? ^_^ Nindut sad unta to hisgutan tong prophecy ni Jonathan Cahn about Shemitah kay accurate iya prophecy about economic collapse kaso ma-off topic na diri na thread. hehe..

[rics zalved]

ma OT ta diri bay kung hisgotan ta na diri nga thread

[Brownman_politiks]

pareho ra man na gud ang OSAS og sa doktrina nga mawala imo kaluwasan.

sabta lang jud og pag ayo.

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OSAS = luwas ka but if maka sala ka di pasabot nga di naka luwas, but again if di ka mo repent then di ka luwas or wa ka ma luwas in the first place.

the you can lose your salvation group = ni repent ka so luwas ka, but naka sala ka so duhaduha pa if luwas ba ka or dili but if mo repent ka so pasabot luwas ka.

nakita ninyo ang common context sa duha? hehe ...

[emow]

if there is a thing as Gods plan, it doesnt matter.

[PhakSheet]

Kung magsalig lang sa faith ang mga tawo kay mura na silag c Juan Tamad ana.
Magsige nalang ug ampo nga "Lord, nitoo ug nisalig jud ko nimo Lord nga imo ko'ng
luwason sa kalayo sa impyerno" pero magsige lang gihapon ug pakasala.