are we all sinners ??

[munzter666]

which of the ten commandments that indicates an immoral thing before and is considered moral today?

rewind>>>
after receiving the commandments from bush fire.
thou shalt not kill, etc.
few days later, moses et. al., just wiped out an entire tribe for being un-aware of who this bush fire being is.

absolute ika mo? its all gooood? justified? in effective.


"Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral."
-Rev Lovejoy

[AmorsoloX]

I see. So according to your view there's really no such thing as "good" or "evil". Such concepts are really objectively meaningless because they mean different things to different people. So acts like genocide, the Holocaust, the massacre in Maguindanao, rape, child abuse, and other crimes aren't really wrong, they're just morally neutral or insignificant acts. They're merely the consequences of the preferences of some people. Did I understand you correctly?

Also, isn't this also the case when it comes to music and food? Some people prefer rock music over house music. Some people prefer Chinese food over Filipino food. Similarly, some people prefer killing other people over helping them. Am I right?

you got it...

its just of how you color them according to your perception.. it is wrong for you because is against you and it is good for you if it is for your benefit...

you might say that a suicide bomber blowing himself up for his god is bad..but that guy who just blew himself to kingdom come also believed he was doing a holy act...


regarding killing or helping.. it depends on your situation on which one serves your interests better..

the ends justify the means...

killing criminals are just like killing saints... criminals and saints are equally human... it only depends on the executioner on whom he decides to kill which produces the best benefit to the executioner

[treize]

rewind>>>
after receiving the commandments from bush fire.
thou shalt not kill, etc.
few days later, moses et. al., just wiped out an entire tribe for being un-aware of who this bush fire being is.

absolute ika mo? its all gooood? justified? in effective.


"Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral."
-Rev Lovejoy

you're not answering my question...

and how could one man killed 3000 people on the spot?

[miyay]

It is true that each of us perceive the world in our own subjective ways, but I don't think that given that and the conditioning that we received from society, our culture, or whatnot, the objective reality of moral values is undermined.

i see. thanks for answering my questions

[josephdc]

^ No problem.

[josephdc]

"There is no sin. It is you who make sin exist..."

-Gospel of Mary Magdalene 7:13-14

Do you agree with Amorsolo bro that there is no such thing as objective good and evil?

[josephdc]

put the first hand receivers of the so called 10 commandments in the lime light.

those guys DID things today's/NOW people consider weird/immoral/downright disgusting(i.e. slavery, pedophilia, genocide, etc)

coz moses and his ilk had an IN GROUP morality(aged old tradition, with recent 10 commandments under their sleeves) to begin with.

*except of course if you ran into serious bible huggers who will outright claim....nahh, its ALLLL GOOOOOD. deflecting cognitive dissonance and coming out a BIGOT in the process.

Not sure what you mean bro. Amorsolo was saying that he believes there is no such thing as objective right and wrong, that morality is subjective and relative. Do you agree with him?

[josephdc]

rewind>>>
after receiving the commandments from bush fire.
thou shalt not kill, etc.
few days later, moses et. al., just wiped out an entire tribe for being un-aware of who this bush fire being is.

absolute ika mo? its all gooood? justified? in effective.

"Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral."
-Rev Lovejoy

It sounds like you believe in objective right and wrong. So you disagree with Amorsolo?

It also sounds like you believe that account in the Old Testament.

[josephdc]

you got it...

its just of how you color them according to your perception.. it is wrong for you because is against you and it is good for you if it is for your benefit...

you might say that a suicide bomber blowing himself up for his god is bad..but that guy who just blew himself to kingdom come also believed he was doing a holy act...

regarding killing or helping.. it depends on your situation on which one serves your interests better..

the ends justify the means...

killing criminals are just like killing saints... criminals and saints are equally human... it only depends on the executioner on whom he decides to kill which produces the best benefit to the executioner

So the Nazis were justified in killing the Jews because it served their interests better, and the people behind the Massacre in Maguindanao were justified in killing the 57 people because it served their interests better, and rapists are justified in raping women because it served their interests better?

That's a very disturbing view that you hold. How is that different from the views held by the Nazis, the perpetrators of the Maguindanao massacre, rapists and other criminals?

There's also one thing that I don't understand. Is the view that morality is subjective and relative held by all atheists? Because atheists often bring up the issue of the problem of evil whenever there's a new calamity or tragedy, like the earthquake in Haiti. Oftentimes, too, atheists say that there is so much evil in the Old Testament, like they would say that God commanded genocide, etc. They also occasionally mention the Crusades, the Inquisition, and the witch hunts. How can that be when according to your view there is no such thing as right and wrong, good and evil? Can you also respond to that?

[Tirong-say]

rewind>>>
after receiving the commandments from bush fire.
thou shalt not kill, etc.
few days later, moses et. al., just wiped out an entire tribe for being un-aware of who this bush fire being is.

absolute ika mo? its all gooood? justified? in effective.


"Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral."
-Rev Lovejoy

Is killing a part of the ten commandments?
It"s the word of GOD and Moses was only the instrument to convey.