Christianity and violence!

[Gotterdammerung.2]

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there have been all of the newspaper ads which have appeared across the country, encouraging gays to abandon their homosexuality and come to seek "treatment" which would "cure" them of their nasty, sinful ways. According to Christians, these ads are not in any way "anti-gay" since they only "hate the sin, not the sinner." They claim that they are offering "hope, not hatred" with these ads, and that there is nothing about them which could reasonably be construed as helping to promote discriminatory or hateful attitudes. But I ask you: If I were to place full page ads explaining that Christianity is a Bad Thing and that people should come to me for "treatment" which would "cure" them of their horrible propensity to be Christians, how would that be construed?
Does anyone imagine that I would not receive massive criticism for writing anti-Christian propaganda? Even this very article will be seen as anti-Christian by many - and this at least is offering extended, rational arguments. If any Christian can take those ads, replace "gay" with "Christian," and be offended, then they are nothing short of hypocrites for supporting such ads when aimed at gays.



Christianity & Homosexuality in America: Violence, Discrimination, Hatred

[jamesmusslewhite]

Ad hominem came when you decide to throw one first. not our fault!
Show me where I insulted bodie first, or where I made a false claim. Then show me the verifiable source for his 908 million deaths over 3,300 years claim. Or his use of the Ad hominem. Where is this proof? Stop the crab dance. If you do not have the skills then do not start post.

There were not even 908 million people alive on this planet in the year 1800.
read all the post on your thread next time.

tsk tsk..you are side stepping. You are a failure! You can't defend your faith well.
That is exactly what I was thinking of you.

I do not need to defend my faith to men, I have to show my faith to God. I am not defending the action of godless people who committed murders in the name of their religions. I just have the intellect and maturity to understand what is the true root cause. You just want to drive your personal agenda. You do not want debate. You want acceptance and a sense of vindication, sorry I am not a yes man or ass-kisser. You talk of the effects of a disease, where I am talking of the source and the cure.

[jamesmusslewhite]

there have been all of the newspaper ads which have appeared across the country, encouraging gays to abandon their homosexuality and come to seek "treatment" which would "cure" them of their nasty, sinful ways. According to Christians, these ads are not in any way "anti-gay" since they only "hate the sin, not the sinner." They claim that they are offering "hope, not hatred" with these ads, and that there is nothing about them which could reasonably be construed as helping to promote discriminatory or hateful attitudes. But I ask you: If I were to place full page ads explaining that Christianity is a Bad Thing and that people should come to me for "treatment" which would "cure" them of their horrible propensity to be Christians, how would that be construed?
Does anyone imagine that I would not receive massive criticism for writing anti-Christian propaganda? Even this very article will be seen as anti-Christian by many - and this at least is offering extended, rational arguments. If any Christian can take those ads, replace "gay" with "Christian," and be offended, then they are nothing short of hypocrites for supporting such ads when aimed at gays.



Christianity & Homosexuality in America: Violence, Discrimination, Hatred

Well if you need treatment, and it is a sin in many religions. Or do you think all Gays must remain Gay and Atheist? There are many gays in the churches, some are even priest, preachers, pastors, deacons, elders, of many religions.

In the US we have this thing called freedom of the press. We as a rule do not censor of execute or members of the press. So you can post your ads. There is a lot of Atheist's speech is supported buy the Constitution and the Supreme Courts. There are lots media outlets and sources to choose from. Your ad may anger people, just as these ads have angered you. That is free speech.
News flash: any ad posted in the US will offend someone someplace. We are fight, sue, or shut the hell up and get over it type of people. That is just Americans.

But here in the Philippine I do not know, here people are so sensitive, everyone gets their feelings hurt a little too easily. They are quick to insult others, but want to knife others if you feel insulted.

[borge_009]

magkuyog jud ni silang duha permi christianity ug violence. as we all know nga ang christianity nahimu na dili tungod sa ilahang pagtuo about gods. Influential, wealthy people and politicians sauna ang nag una2 ana kay ganahn sila nga ang ilahang gi sakop or gi gunitan nga mga taw ma guidan nya ma control nila.....xempre kung ing anang paagi makakwarta sila nya nya xempre naay mga taw nga di mutuo so anha na mugawas ang violence........

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Show me where I insulted bodie first, or where I made a false claim. Then show me the verifiable source for his 908 million deaths over 3,300 years claim. Or his use of the Ad hominem. Where is this proof? Stop the crab dance. If you do not have the skills then do not start post.

did i say you threw one on bodie? tsk tsk...get your brain straight.

you know what, I think you need some brain foods to pump your I.Q, you can't hit the main issue. you want your proof? re-read all your responses start from your first post in this thread. If you can't spot it, there must be something wrong with your brain.

There were not even 908 million people alive on this planet in the year 1800.
read all the post on your thread next time.

how many times should we tell you that numbers do not matter before your brain can grasp it? tsk tsk...THe main issue is not about who murdered the most, listen here... your Religion murdered people in the name of your God, that's the issue. don't push your argument to the side.

read your post in this thread next time.

That is exactly what I was thinking of you

I don't believe that,why? your posts shows that you are incapable of thinking correctly, you even believe in a god whom you can't prove.

Again stick to the issue and stop presenting arguments that are senseless. Your God ordered the death of pregnant women and Children in the Old testament, your brothers Murdered millions in the name of your God. so stop your excuses.

bringing in the Atheists and comparing their stats to the numbers of people killed by your Religion won't help you negate the fact that crime was done in the name of your God.

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Well if you need treatment, and it is a sin in many religions. Or do you think all Gays must remain Gay and Atheist? There are many gays in the churches, some are even priest, preachers, pastors, deacons, elders, of many religions.

In the US we have this thing called freedom of the press. We as a rule do not censor of execute or members of the press. So you can post your ads. There is a lot of Atheist's speech is supported buy the Constitution and the Supreme Courts. There are lots media outlets and sources to choose from. Your ad may anger people, just as these ads have angered you. That is free speech.
News flash: any ad posted in the US will offend someone someplace. We are fight, sue, or shut the hell up and get over it type of people. That is just Americans.

But here in the Philippine I do not know, here people are so sensitive, everyone gets their feelings hurt a little too easily. They are quick to insult others, but want to knife others if you feel insulted.

my goodness, see, this is my point..YOU ARE NOT GETTING the point. you really need to eat some brain foods.

Read the article again. I am beginning to think that your brain stopped thinking after you became a Christian.

[jamesmusslewhite]

bodie stayed within the topic thus i gave him +10
You gave a point totally missing the main issue thus i gave you -10

by the way just in case you think too highly of yourself, let me drop this one on you...your logic has no hint of genius at all.
No I think of myself as just a man with faults, who is no better than any other. The only difference is beliefs. Am I smarter than you two make-believe Einsteins. Only time will tell.
Also just because someone does not agree with you and calls you down for stupid statements is not an ad hominem. This forum's members uses the term way too much. It is just a cop out for not answering for or correcting a stupid or false statement. Often the one that uses the term employs the same tactic when it suits them.

let me show you what true genius is... read here..."So giving figures that shows how shallow your own numbers are makes me a better murderer? Since my rough numbers shows how baseless your claims are, you resort to ad hominem attacks now.
His figures supported my figures! His source did not support his. And you call that genius? He shot himself in the foot, and you call that genius? Priceless
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

Your argument: Religion is not the problem, Atheist are the problem. Look, atheist leaders killed a lot of people. I have numbers, so and so who happens to lead this country killed x people.
My point was Religion and Atheism were not the problem that it was acts of evil men. That man needs no titles or religious belief system to commit murder. Communism killed religious and non religious that is the point that eludes you. That is the point you choose to ignore, because it challenges your belief. Atheist trying to act as saints. Still no proof of 908 million religious murders, just double talk. Yep sheer Genius.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

My counter: Your proof does not make sense. The number of people killed by so and so leader has nothing to do with being an atheist or not. And as a side note, lets look at the number of people who died who died in the name of religion. Your grasping at straws. "
Yes an 2 Atheist Leader pushing a godless agenda killing 79.5-135 million people many of them people of religion is not important. The fact that evil men kill just to be evil, does burst your little only Religion kills theory. So countering with false claims and false numbers is an act of genius to you? Interesting.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

Here is another one..."I believe this entire thread was created to address the disconnect between the teachings of the Christian church and the actions of many of its members. Things like the crusades, the inquisition, bombings of abortion clinics and a lot of other things."
No it was made so you can dictate a one side debate. the Crusades and the Inquisition both were more Political then religious. But you do not want to talk about anything but "Religion Bad" Not the real sources of the evil acts.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

That's what I call Genius. Not running away from the real issue and hitting the point right at the center.
Than you have a shallow and loose interpretation of genius. Way to really lower the bar.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

Those guys you mentioned did not kill FOR atheism. Your guys on the other hand in the name of God annihilated millions. poor you.
I see, they were nice guys who where just purging religion from their cultures, by sending there citizens to their Gods. But when to opposing armies of two different cultures and religions fought over land possession they were EVIL RELIGIONS. Genius? No. Bias? Yes.
Yes and people like you killed people, as well and in more numbers than religions ever have. Nice of you to try to hid from your own inherent nature. Poor you.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

I follow Christ and he tell me to love my neighbor more than myself. To feed, cloth, and love my neighbor. To forgive my enemies. To judge not or be judge, and God said "Thy shall not commit Murder." and "Vengeance is mine, and mine alone." I know what the text teaches. I read it for myself and live by the text.
Christ's words tell me to love not hate my neighbor. Tells me to love those that hate me. He tells me to forgive those that insult me. He tells me to forgive you. I just remember what bodie said,
"Not unexpected from the likes if you."

[Gotterdammerung.2]

No I think of myself as just a man with faults, who is no better than any other. The only difference is beliefs. Am I smarter than you two make-believe Einsteins. Only time will tell.
Also just because someone does not agree with you and calls you down for stupid statements is not an ad hominem. This forum's members uses the term way too much. It is just a cop out for not answering for or correcting a stupid or false statement. Often the one that uses the term employs the same tactic when it suits them.

you can say whatever you want, you can even continue behaving like a paranoid, the fact still remain, you started the ad hominem.

His figures supported my figures! His source did not support his. And you call that genius? He shot himself in the foot, and you call that genius? Priceless
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

im not looking at the numbers HELLO, how many times must I repeat that point to you? tsk tsk...bodie was right on target and you missed terribly. and YES bodie is Genius.

My point was Religion and Atheism were not the problem that it was acts of evil men. That man needs no titles or religious belief system to commit murder. Communism killed religious and non religious that is the point that eludes you. That is the point you choose to ignore, because it challenges your belief. Atheist trying to act as saints. Still no proof of 908 million religious murders, just double talk. Yep sheer Genius.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

no proof? Are you sure, again im not talking about numbers. Millions were killed in the name of your GOD. I don't care if Communists have killed billions that's expected of them BUT Religious people killing in the name of God, whoa!!! that's a headline!!!

Yes an 2 Atheist Leader pushing a godless agenda killing 79.5-135 million people many of them people of religion is not important. The fact that evil men kill just to be evil, does burst your little only Religion kills theory. So countering with false claims and false numbers is an act of genius to you? Interesting.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

you started this battle for numbers w/c is totally a non-issue. so what if communists have killed billions? can that change the fact that your brothers murdered million people in the name of your God?

No it was made so you can dictate a one side debate. the Crusades and the Inquisition both were more Political then religious. But you do not want to talk about anything but "Religion Bad" Not the real sources of the evil acts.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

political or not, still they murdered millions in the name of your God just like Moses had killed pregnant women and children mercilessly in the past.

Than you have a shallow and loose interpretation of genius. Way to really lower the bar.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

you can't even spot a main issue and now you want to dictate what is shallow and real genius is ? haha.

I see, they were nice guys who where just purging religion from their cultures, by sending there citizens to their Gods. But when to opposing armies of two different cultures and religions fought over land possession they were EVIL RELIGIONS. Genius? No. Bias? Yes.
Yes and people like you killed people, as well and in more numbers than religions ever have. Nice of you to try to hid from your own inherent nature. Poor you.
As bodie said, "Not unexpected from the likes if you."

you are mispresenting what I said, Is this the best you can do? may your god help you. re-read my post again. It says...Those GUYS never killed in the name of atheism, but your guys killed millions in the name of God.

Hear what john Calvin's idea of what should be done to a heretic...

...after he [Servetus] had been recognized, I thought he should be detained. My friend Nicolas summoned him on a capital charge, offering himself as a security according to the lex talionis. On the following day he adduced against him forty written charges. He at first sought to evade them. Accordingly we were summoned. He impudently reviled me, just as if he regarded me as obnoxious to him. I answered him as he deserved... of the man’s effrontery I will say nothing; but such was his madness that he did not hesitate to say that devils possessed divinity; yea, that many gods were in individual devils, inasmuch as a deity had been substantially communicated to those equally with wood and stone. I hope that sentence of death will at least be passed on him; but I desired that the severity of the punishment be mitigated.

you don't agree with my doctrine? bang!!! youre dead.

[Gotterdammerung.2]

I follow Christ and he tell me to love my neighbor more than myself. To feed, cloth, and love my neighbor. To forgive my enemies. To judge not or be judge, and God said "Thy shall not commit Murder." and "Vengeance is mine, and mine alone." I know what the text teaches. I read it for myself and live by the text.
Christ's words tell me to love not hate my neighbor. Tells me to love those that hate me. He tells me to forgive those that insult me. He tells me to forgive you. I just remember what bodie said,
"Not unexpected from the likes if you."

sure im not contesting your loyalty to your christ. go ahead follow him...just like those murderers who followed him also profess to love their neighbors,feed the hungry and so on...

[jamesmusslewhite]

my goodness, see, this is my point..YOU ARE NOT GETTING the point. you really need to eat some brain foods.
No you need to eat you meds, so you can lighten up, Boy.
Look I lived 50 years in the United States. Most of it in Houston, Texas in an area called Montrose. It had one of the largest Gay populations in the United States. They had all right as any other citizen in the United States. I know the media and the Atheist movement. I know that if you posted the ad you spoke of, you would be allowed. Would you anger people yes.

A Homophobe does not need religion to feel being Gay is wrong. That is what it is. I read your Atheist oriented website But it has steadily improved for the now 10% of the American population that are Homosexual. I have watched the progression over 35 years. I have a step brother who I love very much who is Gay.
Your point? I am suppose to get your Point? Oh am I suppose to hate someone because of your point? Who are you exactly? God still said it is a sin. Is this the root of your obsession, are you an Atheist because the church rejects your being gay? Or is this just another crusade issue to feed your own obsession?

Homosexuality is a conscious choice. Homosexuality is in most part a progression of initiation not procreation. They are just regular citizens and not a minority class, social class, or nationality.

I have an idea kill everyone that is not Gay so it makes Gay's feel better about themselves. Kill everyone who is religious so those of no religion can feel better about themselves. OK who do we kill next so you will feel better about yourself?

Read the article again. I am beginning to think that your brain stopped thinking after you became a Christian.
I read it twice, that is enough.
The insults again, that is what you call being intelligent? I believe your hatred for religion consumes you like a cancer. In Texas we call it Rectum Optics - that is someone has their head stuck so far up their own ass that it gives them a shitty outlook on life. You want me to turn from my faith because you have non. I am suppose to feel shame because the acts of others, even if made 3,300 years ago? Why so you feel better? You want to point all the flaws in religion, and ignore your own flaws. You are young and think you are blazing a path, later when you are younger you will find it was just a trodden path.

I love the Atheist Double Standard. when Christians post we must only use non religious websites, even education and government sites are not good enough. Yet when Atheist post they can use Atheist based sites as fact not to be challenge. Sorry as a Christian I am told to challenge everything.

I was were you are now, and for me to join you; I would have to take a huge step backwards.