Christianity and violence!

[kebotDiNaMute]

---

did I mention abandoning faith? Can you please present my arguments the way I put it? spare me from your malicious interpretations.

I am saying that Christians are no different from ordinary and sinful people. They can commit lies,murder,bombings and so on. don't think too much!

Idiotas brad,

Christians are Humans, You are Human(not unless you don't want...). What you are pointing out are the possibilities of what we can do as Human. dba?

The difference is We see those as BAD. What about you? Ok lang kay d btaw mo Christian... hahaha! unsa ni previledge? pft... change your thinking tawn oi...

Yes Christian are Sinful but we admit it. So what, better lie and look good? well we don't feel that way... hahay! Your argument makes you look bad!

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Christians because of the bible were inspired to bombed abortion clinics.
--- how many again? brad some people take the burden to stop it at all costs because they cannot take it. Brad if ok ra nmo ang massacre, some people will not tolerate it. Question is it wrong? yes it is... you just cannot take life at your own hands. Were they christian, Yes, is that the Christian way, NO. so unsa na? hmmmm.

The point of those verses is to show that your God is violent.
--- nope, it pointed out that he has ANGER. And Death is his ways... If you don't obey, you DIE. But that was before, and solely for Israelites. Why did you complain, you are not a Jew... aw pede diay... HUDIYO mand diay... hahah!

hmmmm....you must think clearly. to do that you must calm down. haha

again the issue is about Christians committing crimes, numbers do not matter, the point is the bible's antagonistic view on abortion and homosexuality has inspired CHRISTIANS to bombed abortion clinics and fueled HATRED towards the 3rd ***, that's the point. Don't turn your head around. lisod ba itan-aw og tarong kong imo ng relihiyon ang maka commit sa crime? haha...

Are you asking me if that's the Christian way? YES...read again your bible...and search Calvinism vs Arminianism in the late centuries of Christendom, you'll be surprise that these people would kill each other over proper interpretation of the doctrine of Soteriology. tsk tsk...sakto ko sayop ka...BANG! BANG! BANG! ako ang sakto kamo ang sayop...BOOOOOM!!!!

The point of those verses is to show that your God is violent.
--- nope, it pointed out that he has ANGER. And Death is his ways... If you don't obey, you DIE. But that was before, and solely for Israelites. Why did you complain, you are not a Jew... aw pede diay... HUDIYO mand diay... hahah!

right right, God has ANGER and DEATH is His ways...you know what? He should take anger management...

You don't obey...BOOOOOOOOOM!!!! now I know why you are full of anger kebotDiNamute, you got that from your Father.

God ordered Moses to kill pregnant women and children, those were non-Isrealites, tsk tsk...gabasa ba ka og bible? haha, hala basa osa.



karon kong wa pay balaod against free speech and religion im sure osa ka sa mopatay nako. haha!!!

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Idiotas brad,

Christians are Humans, You are Human(not unless you don't want...). What you are pointing out are the possibilities of what we can do as Human. dba?

The difference is We see those as BAD. What about you? Ok lang kay d btaw mo Christian... hahaha! unsa ni previledge? pft... change your thinking tawn oi...

Yes Christian are Sinful but we admit it. So what, better lie and look good? well we don't feel that way... hahay! Your argument makes you look bad!

hmmm...

you see what as bad? are you sure or are you playing favorites? let us see, Your God had killed innocent children and pregnant women, bad or not? im gonna guess the answer, it's no right? haha.

so if God commits murder then it's okay.

[Gotterdammerung.2]

We thank Fate and Destiny for She has given us wisdom and freedom from Religious bigotry. If it wasn't for the brave people of long time ago the world will be under the power of these Demons clothed in sheep's clothing.

read this and you'll know what I mean...from WiKi...


Michael Servetus (also Miguel Servet or Miguel Serveto; 29 September 1511 – 27 October 1553) was a Spanish (Aragonese) theologian, physician, cartographer, and humanist. He was the first European to describe the function of pulmonary circulation. His interests included many sciences: astronomy and meteorology; geography, jurisprudence, study of the Bible, mathematics, anatomy, and medicine. He is renowned in the history of several of these fields, particularly medicine and theology. He participated in the Protestant Reformation, and later developed a nontrinitarian Christology. Condemned by Catholics and Protestants alike, he was arrested in Geneva and burnt at the stake as a heretic by order of the Protestant Geneva governing council.


Servetus rejected the belief of the Trinity, stating that it was not based on the Bible. He argued that it arose from teachings of (Greek) philosophers, and he advocated a return to the simplicity of the Gospels and the teachings of the early Church Fathers that he believed pre-dated the development of trinitarianism. Servetus hoped that the dismissal of the Trinitarian dogma would make Christianity more appealing to believers in Judaism and Islam, which had preserved the unity of God in their teachings. According to Servetus, trinitarians had turned Christianity into a form of "tritheism", or belief in three gods. Servetus affirmed that the divine Logos, the manifestation of God and not a separate divine Person, was incarnated in a human being, Jesus, when God's spirit came into the womb of the Virgin Mary. Only from the moment of conception, was the Son actually generated. Therefore the Son was not eternal, but only the Logos from which He was formed. For this reason, Servetus always rejected calling Christ the "eternal Son of God" but rather called him "the Son of the eternal God." [5] In describing Servetus' view of the Logos, Andrew Dibb explained: "In 'Genesis' God reveals himself as the creator. In 'John' he reveals that he created by means of the Word, or Logos. Finally, also in 'John', he shows that this Logos became flesh and 'dwelt among us'. Creation took place by the spoken word, for God said "Let there be ..." The spoken word of Genesis, the Logos of John, and the Christ, are all one and the same."[6]

Servetus was condemned on two counts, for spreading and preaching Nontrinitarianism and anti-paedobaptism (anti-infant baptism).[20] Of paedobaptism Servetus had said, "It is an invention of the devil, an infernal falsity for the destruction of all Christianity."[21] In the case the procureur général (chief public prosecutor) added some curious sounding accusations in the form of inquiries—the most odd sounding perhaps being, "whether he has married, and if he answers that he has not, he shall be asked why, in consideration of his age, he could refrain so long from marriage." To this oblique imputation of unchastity, Servetus replied that rupture had long since made him incapable of that particular sin. More offensive to modern ears might be the question "whether he did not know that his doctrine was pernicious, considering that he favours Jews and Turks, by making excuses for them, and if he has not studied the Koran in order to disprove and controvert the doctrine and religion that the Christian churches hold, together with other profane books, from which people ought to abstain in matters of religion, according to the doctrine of St. Paul." Calvin believed Servetus deserving of death on account of what he termed as his "execrable blasphemies".[22] Calvin expressed these sentiments in a letter to Farel, written about a week after Servetus’ arrest, in which he also mentioned an exchange with Servetus. Calvin wrote:
“ ...after he [Servetus] had been recognized, I thought he should be detained. My friend Nicolas summoned him on a capital charge, offering himself as a security according to the lex talionis. On the following day he adduced against him forty written charges. He at first sought to evade them. Accordingly we were summoned. He impudently reviled me, just as if he regarded me as obnoxious to him. I answered him as he deserved... of the man’s effrontery I will say nothing; but such was his madness that he did not hesitate to say that devils possessed divinity; yea, that many gods were in individual devils, inasmuch as a deity had been substantially communicated to those equally with wood and stone. I hope that sentence of death will at least be passed on him; but I desired that the severity of the punishment be mitigated.[23]
Whoever shall maintain that wrong is done to heretics and blasphemers in punishing them makes himself an accomplice in their crime and guilty as they are. There is no question here of man's authority; it is God who speaks, and clear it is what law he will have kept in the church, even to the end of the world. Wherefore does he demand of us a so extreme severity, if not to show us that due honor is not paid him, so long as we set not his service above every human consideration, so that we spare not kin, nor blood of any, and forget all humanity when the matter is to combat for His glory.[27]


more on John Calvin....(google his name)

Calvin wrote to William Farel that “if he [Servetus] shall come [to Geneva], I shall never permit him to depart alive, provided my authority be of any avail”


on luther....

Luther wrote against the “Against the Robbing and Murdering Hordes of Peasants” and said “Let whoever can stab, smite, slay. If you die in doing it, good for you! A more blessed death can never be yours…” There is no record of Luther repenting for encouraging the killing of the peasants. In fact, he later stated “I, Martin Luther, have shed the blood of the rebellious peasants; for I commanded them to be killed. Their blood is indeed upon my head; but I put it upon the Lord God, by whose command I spoke” (Table Talk, p. 276. Eisleben edition).



unfortunately these kind of people still exist today. dili lang kalihok kay piti man sila sa balaod.

[jamesmusslewhite]

Well it is easy to see Pharaoh's harden heart on this thread. The same God haters shaking their defiant fist at something so much greater than their simple minds can even comprehend. False boasts by hollow shells. When I think that I actually use to think the same way, you make me realize just how foolish I sounded to those who possessed faith. I use to be that pathetic? How foolish is the false pride of a lost soul.

I thank God and Christ for delivering me from that foolishness of the damned, and it makes me cherish his gift of faith so much more. Thank you.

[honey89]

We thank Fate and Destiny for She has given us wisdom and freedom from Religious bigotry. If it wasn't for the brave people of long time ago the world will be under the power of these Demons clothed in sheep's clothing.

read this and you'll know what I mean...from WiKi...


Michael Servetus (also Miguel Servet or Miguel Serveto; 29 September 1511 – 27 October 1553) was a Spanish (Aragonese) theologian, physician, cartographer, and humanist. He was the first European to describe the function of pulmonary circulation. His interests included many sciences: astronomy and meteorology; geography, jurisprudence, study of the Bible, mathematics, anatomy, and medicine. He is renowned in the history of several of these fields, particularly medicine and theology. He participated in the Protestant Reformation, and later developed a nontrinitarian Christology. Condemned by Catholics and Protestants alike, he was arrested in Geneva and burnt at the stake as a heretic by order of the Protestant Geneva governing council.


Servetus rejected the belief of the Trinity, stating that it was not based on the Bible. He argued that it arose from teachings of (Greek) philosophers, and he advocated a return to the simplicity of the Gospels and the teachings of the early Church Fathers that he believed pre-dated the development of trinitarianism. Servetus hoped that the dismissal of the Trinitarian dogma would make Christianity more appealing to believers in Judaism and Islam, which had preserved the unity of God in their teachings. According to Servetus, trinitarians had turned Christianity into a form of "tritheism", or belief in three gods. Servetus affirmed that the divine Logos, the manifestation of God and not a separate divine Person, was incarnated in a human being, Jesus, when God's spirit came into the womb of the Virgin Mary. Only from the moment of conception, was the Son actually generated. Therefore the Son was not eternal, but only the Logos from which He was formed. For this reason, Servetus always rejected calling Christ the "eternal Son of God" but rather called him "the Son of the eternal God." [5] In describing Servetus' view of the Logos, Andrew Dibb explained: "In 'Genesis' God reveals himself as the creator. In 'John' he reveals that he created by means of the Word, or Logos. Finally, also in 'John', he shows that this Logos became flesh and 'dwelt among us'. Creation took place by the spoken word, for God said "Let there be ..." The spoken word of Genesis, the Logos of John, and the Christ, are all one and the same."[6]

Servetus was condemned on two counts, for spreading and preaching Nontrinitarianism and anti-paedobaptism (anti-infant baptism).[20] Of paedobaptism Servetus had said, "It is an invention of the devil, an infernal falsity for the destruction of all Christianity."[21] In the case the procureur général (chief public prosecutor) added some curious sounding accusations in the form of inquiries—the most odd sounding perhaps being, "whether he has married, and if he answers that he has not, he shall be asked why, in consideration of his age, he could refrain so long from marriage." To this oblique imputation of unchastity, Servetus replied that rupture had long since made him incapable of that particular sin. More offensive to modern ears might be the question "whether he did not know that his doctrine was pernicious, considering that he favours Jews and Turks, by making excuses for them, and if he has not studied the Koran in order to disprove and controvert the doctrine and religion that the Christian churches hold, together with other profane books, from which people ought to abstain in matters of religion, according to the doctrine of St. Paul." Calvin believed Servetus deserving of death on account of what he termed as his "execrable blasphemies".[22] Calvin expressed these sentiments in a letter to Farel, written about a week after Servetus’ arrest, in which he also mentioned an exchange with Servetus. Calvin wrote:
“ ...after he [Servetus] had been recognized, I thought he should be detained. My friend Nicolas summoned him on a capital charge, offering himself as a security according to the lex talionis. On the following day he adduced against him forty written charges. He at first sought to evade them. Accordingly we were summoned. He impudently reviled me, just as if he regarded me as obnoxious to him. I answered him as he deserved... of the man’s effrontery I will say nothing; but such was his madness that he did not hesitate to say that devils possessed divinity; yea, that many gods were in individual devils, inasmuch as a deity had been substantially communicated to those equally with wood and stone. I hope that sentence of death will at least be passed on him; but I desired that the severity of the punishment be mitigated.[23]
Whoever shall maintain that wrong is done to heretics and blasphemers in punishing them makes himself an accomplice in their crime and guilty as they are. There is no question here of man's authority; it is God who speaks, and clear it is what law he will have kept in the church, even to the end of the world. Wherefore does he demand of us a so extreme severity, if not to show us that due honor is not paid him, so long as we set not his service above every human consideration, so that we spare not kin, nor blood of any, and forget all humanity when the matter is to combat for His glory.[27]


more on John Calvin....(google his name)

Calvin wrote to William Farel that “if he [Servetus] shall come [to Geneva], I shall never permit him to depart alive, provided my authority be of any avail”


on luther....

Luther wrote against the “Against the Robbing and Murdering Hordes of Peasants” and said “Let whoever can stab, smite, slay. If you die in doing it, good for you! A more blessed death can never be yours…” There is no record of Luther repenting for encouraging the killing of the peasants. In fact, he later stated “I, Martin Luther, have shed the blood of the rebellious peasants; for I commanded them to be killed. Their blood is indeed upon my head; but I put it upon the Lord God, by whose command I spoke” (Table Talk, p. 276. Eisleben edition).



unfortunately these kind of people still exist today. dili lang kalihok kay piti man sila sa balaod.

Don't take this personally, but Wiki is not that reliable. It's easy to manipulate the contents. If you have other papers, links, or researches from independent but reputable websites, I think it would be better.

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Well it is easy to see Pharaoh's harden heart on this thread. The same God haters shaking their defiant fist at something so much greater than their simple minds can even comprehend. False boasts by hollow shells. When I think that I actually use to think the same way, you make me realize just how foolish I sounded to those who possessed faith. I use to be that pathetic? How foolish is the false pride of a lost soul.

You can't even give a concrete proof of your God, how pathetic.

I thank God and Christ for delivering me from that foolishness of the damned, and it makes me cherish his gift of faith so much more. Thank you.

*scratching my head...I thank my teachers for delivering me from the foolishness of the deluded and it makes me cherish their gift of logic so much more, thank you!!!

[Gotterdammerung.2]

Don't take this personally, but Wiki is not that reliable. It's easy to manipulate the contents. If you have other papers, links, or researches from independent but reputable websites, I think it would be better.

can i have your proof that it was manipulated? and do you know how to use Wiki? don't take this personally but I think you need to study your history. I bet you don't even know who John Calvin was? do you?



Notes

1. ^ a b Goldstone, Lawrence; Nancy Goldstone (2002). Out of the Flames: The Remarkable Story of a Fearless Scholar, a Fatal Heresy, and One of the Rarest Books in the World. New York, New York: Broadway Books. pp. 7. ISBN 0-7679-0836-8.
2. ^ Drummond, William H. (184. The Life of Michael Servetus: The Spanish Physician, Who, for the Alleged Crime of Heresy, was Entrapped, Imprisoned, and Burned, by John Calvin the Reformer, in the City of Geneva, October 27, 1553. London, England: John Chapman. pp. 2.
3. ^ a b Drummond, p3.
4. ^ Wright, Richard (1806). An Apology for Dr. Michael Servetus: Including an Account of His Life, Persecution, Writings and Opinions. London: F. B. Wright. pp. 91.
5. ^ 'De trinitatis erroribus', Book 7.
6. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of God, University Press of America, 2005, p. 93. Online at Google Book Search
7. ^ Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone, Out of the Flames, Broadway Books, NY NY, 2002, pp. 71–72
8. ^ Servetus, Restitución del Cristianismo, Spanish edition by Angel Alcalá and Luis Betés, Madrid, Fundación Universitaria Española, 1980, p. 119.
9. ^ See Restitución, p. 137.
10. ^ Restitución, p. 148, 168.
11. ^ Restitución, p. 169.
12. ^ Book VII, Out of the Flames, Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone, Broadway Books, NY, NY, p. 72
13. ^ Downton, An Examination of the Nature of Authority, Chapter 3.
14. ^ Will Durant The Story of Civilization: The Reformation Chapter XXI, page 481
15. ^ Ibid., 2
16. ^ Bainton, Hunted Heretic, p. 103.
17. ^ Hunted Heretic, p. 164.
18. ^ a b The Heretics, p. 326.
19. ^ Hanover History.
20. ^ Hunted Heretic, p. 141.
21. ^ Reyburn, Hugh Young (1914). John Calvin: His Life, Letters, and Work. New York: Hodder and Stoughton. p. 175.
22. ^ Owen, Robert Dale (1872). The debatable Land Between this World and the Next. New York: G.W. Carleton & Co.. p. 69, notes.
23. ^ Calvin to William Farel, August 20, 1553, Bonnet, Jules (1820–1892) Letters of John Calvin, Carlisle, Penn: Banner of Truth Trust, 1980, pp. 158–159. ISBN 0-85151-323-9.
24. ^ Schaff, Philip: History of the Christian Church, Vol. VIII: Modern Christianity: The Swiss Reformation, William B. Eerdmans Pub. Co., Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA, 1910, page 780.
25. ^ The History & Character of Calvinism, p. 176.
26. ^ "Out of the Flames" by Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone - Salon.com
27. ^ Marshall, John (2006). John Locke, Toleration and Early Enlightenment Culture. Cambridge Studies in Early Modern British History. New York: Cambridge University Press. p. 325. ISBN 052165114X. That no such doctrine was ever a part of the teachings of Christ's ministry or the early Christian church has caused no end of debate as to the real intentions of those who tortured and killed those whose views differed from those of the ecclesiastical authorities at the time .
    
    • The Latin reads:
    
    "Nunc vero quisquis haereticis et blasphemis iniuste poenam infligi contendet, sciens et volens eodem se obstringet blasphemiae reatu. His nobis non obtruditur hominum autoritas, sed Deum audimus loquentem, et quid ecclesia suae in perpetuum mandet non obscure intelligimus. Non frustra humanos omnes affectus excutit, quibus molliri corda solent: paternum amorem, quidquid est inter fratres, propinquos et amicos benevolentiae facessere iubet: maritos revocat a thori blanditiis: denique hominess propemodum natura sua exuit, ne quid obstaculi sanctum eorum zelum moretur. Cur tam implacabilis exigitur severitas, nisi ut sciamus non haberi suum Deo honorem, nisi quae illi debetur pietas humanis omnibus officiis praefertur, et quoties asserenda est eius gloria, propemodum ex memoria nostra deletur mutua inter nos humanitas?" Calvin’s Opera, vol. 8, Corpus Reformatorum, vol., 36, p. 475. (vols. 35 & 36 of the CR are one vol.).
28. ^ See Stanislas Kot, "L'influence de Servet sur le mouvement atitrinitarien en Pologne et en Transylvanie", in B. Becker (Ed.), Autour de Michel Servet et de Sebastien Castellion, Haarlem, 1953.
29. ^ Reasons for Faith
30. ^ Why The Trinity Was Accepted
31. ^ Bernard, D. K., The Oneness of God Word Aflame Press, 1983.
32. ^ Servetus, M., De Trinitatis Erroribus, 59b (quoted in Bainton, R.H., Hunted Heretic, Blackstone Editions, 2005, p30
33. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of God, University Press of America, 2005. Online at Google Book Search
34. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of Salvation, online at newchurchhistory.org
35. ^ A. Alcalá, "Los dos grandes legados de Servet: el radicalismo como método intelectual y el derecho a la libertad de conciencia", in Turia, #63-64, March 2003, Teruel (Spain), pp. 221-242.
36. ^ See Marian Hillar & Claire S. Allen, Michael Servetus: Intellectual Giant, Humanist, and Martyr, Lanham, MD, and New York: University Press of America, Inc., 2002.
37. ^ Chairman's Reflections (2004), "Traditional Medicine Among Gulf Arabs, Part II: Blood-letting", Heart Views 5 (2), p. 74-85 [80].
38. ^ Internet Archive Search: creator:"Robert Lalonde"

[edit] Further reading

• Jean Calvin, Defensio orthodoxae fidei de sacra Trinitate contra prodigiosos errores Michaelis Serveti..., (Defense of Orthodox Faith against the Prodigious Errors of the Spaniard Michael Servetus...), Geneva, 1554. Calvin's Opere in the Corpus Reformatorum, vol. viii, 453–644. Ursus Books and Prints. Catalogue of Scarce Books, Americana, Etc. Bangs & Co, p. 41.
• Hunted Heretic: The Life and Death of Michael Servetus 1511–1553 by Roland H. Bainton. Revised Edition edited by Peter Hughes with an introduction by Ángel Alcalá. Blackstone Editions. ISBN 0-9725017-3-8.
• Out of the Flames: The Remarkable Story of a Fearless Scholar, a Fatal Heresy, and One of the Rarest Books in the World by Lawrence Goldstone and Nancy Goldstone. ISBN 0-7679-0837-6.
• Michael Servetus: Intellectual Giant, Humanist, and Martyr by Marian Hillar, 2003. ISBN 0761824006.
• The Case of Michael Servetus: (1511–1553 : The Turning Point in the Struggle for Freedom of Conscience) by Marian Hillar, 1997. ISBN 0773485724.
• The Heretics: Heresy Through the Ages by Walter Nigg. Alfred A. Knopf, Inc., 1962. (Republished by Dorset Press, 1990. ISBN 0-88029-455-8)
• The History and Character of Calvinism by John T. McNeill, New York: Oxford University Press, 1954. ISBN 0-19-500743-3.
• Bonnet, Jules (1820–1892) Letters of John Calvin, Carlisle, Penn: The Banner of Truth Trust, 1980. ISBN 0-85151-323-9.
• Find in a Library with WorldCat. Contains seventy letters of Calvin, several of which discuss his plans for, and dealings with, Servetus. Also includes his final discourses and his last will and testament (April 25, 1564).
• Jules Bonnet, Letters of John Calvin, 2 vols., 1855, 1857, Edinburgh, Thomas Constable and Co.: Little, Brown, and Co., Boston—The Internet Archive
• The Man from Mars: His Morals, Politics and Religion by William Simpson, San Francisco: E.D. Beattle, 1900. Excerpts from letters of Servetus, written from his prison cell in Geneva (1553), pp. 30–31. Google Books.
• A complete translation of Christianismi Restitutio into English (the first ever) by Christopher Hoffman and Marian Hillar was published on April 30, 2007.[1] [2]
• Michael Servetus, Heretic or Saint?

Are those enough or you want more?

[honey89]

can i have your proof that it was manipulated? and do you know how to use Wiki? don't take this personally but I think you need to study your history. I bet you don't even know who John Calvin was? do you?



Notes

1. ^ a b Goldstone, Lawrence; Nancy Goldstone (2002). Out of the Flames: The Remarkable Story of a Fearless Scholar, a Fatal Heresy, and One of the Rarest Books in the World. New York, New York: Broadway Books. pp. 7. ISBN 0-7679-0836-8.
2. ^ Drummond, William H. (184. The Life of Michael Servetus: The Spanish Physician, Who, for the Alleged Crime of Heresy, was Entrapped, Imprisoned, and Burned, by John Calvin the Reformer, in the City of Geneva, October 27, 1553. London, England: John Chapman. pp. 2.
3. ^ a b Drummond, p3.
4. ^ Wright, Richard (1806). An Apology for Dr. Michael Servetus: Including an Account of His Life, Persecution, Writings and Opinions. London: F. B. Wright. pp. 91.
5. ^ 'De trinitatis erroribus', Book 7.
6. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of God, University Press of America, 2005, p. 93. Online at Google Book Search
7. ^ Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone, Out of the Flames, Broadway Books, NY NY, 2002, pp. 71–72
8. ^ Servetus, Restitución del Cristianismo, Spanish edition by Angel Alcalá and Luis Betés, Madrid, Fundación Universitaria Española, 1980, p. 119.
9. ^ See Restitución, p. 137.
10. ^ Restitución, p. 148, 168.
11. ^ Restitución, p. 169.
12. ^ Book VII, Out of the Flames, Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone, Broadway Books, NY, NY, p. 72
13. ^ Downton, An Examination of the Nature of Authority, Chapter 3.
14. ^ Will Durant The Story of Civilization: The Reformation Chapter XXI, page 481
15. ^ Ibid., 2
16. ^ Bainton, Hunted Heretic, p. 103.
17. ^ Hunted Heretic, p. 164.
18. ^ a b The Heretics, p. 326.
19. ^ Hanover History.
20. ^ Hunted Heretic, p. 141.
21. ^ Reyburn, Hugh Young (1914). John Calvin: His Life, Letters, and Work. New York: Hodder and Stoughton. p. 175.
22. ^ Owen, Robert Dale (1872). The debatable Land Between this World and the Next. New York: G.W. Carleton & Co.. p. 69, notes.
23. ^ Calvin to William Farel, August 20, 1553, Bonnet, Jules (1820–1892) Letters of John Calvin, Carlisle, Penn: Banner of Truth Trust, 1980, pp. 158–159. ISBN 0-85151-323-9.
24. ^ Schaff, Philip: History of the Christian Church, Vol. VIII: Modern Christianity: The Swiss Reformation, William B. Eerdmans Pub. Co., Grand Rapids, Michigan, USA, 1910, page 780.
25. ^ The History & Character of Calvinism, p. 176.
26. ^ "Out of the Flames" by Lawrence and Nancy Goldstone - Salon.com
27. ^ Marshall, John (2006). John Locke, Toleration and Early Enlightenment Culture. Cambridge Studies in Early Modern British History. New York: Cambridge University Press. p. 325. ISBN 052165114X. That no such doctrine was ever a part of the teachings of Christ's ministry or the early Christian church has caused no end of debate as to the real intentions of those who tortured and killed those whose views differed from those of the ecclesiastical authorities at the time .
    
    • The Latin reads:
    
    "Nunc vero quisquis haereticis et blasphemis iniuste poenam infligi contendet, sciens et volens eodem se obstringet blasphemiae reatu. His nobis non obtruditur hominum autoritas, sed Deum audimus loquentem, et quid ecclesia suae in perpetuum mandet non obscure intelligimus. Non frustra humanos omnes affectus excutit, quibus molliri corda solent: paternum amorem, quidquid est inter fratres, propinquos et amicos benevolentiae facessere iubet: maritos revocat a thori blanditiis: denique hominess propemodum natura sua exuit, ne quid obstaculi sanctum eorum zelum moretur. Cur tam implacabilis exigitur severitas, nisi ut sciamus non haberi suum Deo honorem, nisi quae illi debetur pietas humanis omnibus officiis praefertur, et quoties asserenda est eius gloria, propemodum ex memoria nostra deletur mutua inter nos humanitas?" Calvin’s Opera, vol. 8, Corpus Reformatorum, vol., 36, p. 475. (vols. 35 & 36 of the CR are one vol.).
28. ^ See Stanislas Kot, "L'influence de Servet sur le mouvement atitrinitarien en Pologne et en Transylvanie", in B. Becker (Ed.), Autour de Michel Servet et de Sebastien Castellion, Haarlem, 1953.
29. ^ Reasons for Faith
30. ^ Why The Trinity Was Accepted
31. ^ Bernard, D. K., The Oneness of God Word Aflame Press, 1983.
32. ^ Servetus, M., De Trinitatis Erroribus, 59b (quoted in Bainton, R.H., Hunted Heretic, Blackstone Editions, 2005, p30
33. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of God, University Press of America, 2005. Online at Google Book Search
34. ^ Andrew M. T. Dibb, Servetus, Swedenborg and the Nature of Salvation, online at newchurchhistory.org
35. ^ A. Alcalá, "Los dos grandes legados de Servet: el radicalismo como método intelectual y el derecho a la libertad de conciencia", in Turia, #63-64, March 2003, Teruel (Spain), pp. 221-242.
36. ^ See Marian Hillar & Claire S. Allen, Michael Servetus: Intellectual Giant, Humanist, and Martyr, Lanham, MD, and New York: University Press of America, Inc., 2002.
37. ^ Chairman's Reflections (2004), "Traditional Medicine Among Gulf Arabs, Part II: Blood-letting", Heart Views 5 (2), p. 74-85 [80].
38. ^ Internet Archive Search: creator:"Robert Lalonde"

[edit] Further reading

• Jean Calvin, Defensio orthodoxae fidei de sacra Trinitate contra prodigiosos errores Michaelis Serveti..., (Defense of Orthodox Faith against the Prodigious Errors of the Spaniard Michael Servetus...), Geneva, 1554. Calvin's Opere in the Corpus Reformatorum, vol. viii, 453–644. Ursus Books and Prints. Catalogue of Scarce Books, Americana, Etc. Bangs & Co, p. 41.
• Hunted Heretic: The Life and Death of Michael Servetus 1511–1553 by Roland H. Bainton. Revised Edition edited by Peter Hughes with an introduction by Ángel Alcalá. Blackstone Editions. ISBN 0-9725017-3-8.
• Out of the Flames: The Remarkable Story of a Fearless Scholar, a Fatal Heresy, and One of the Rarest Books in the World by Lawrence Goldstone and Nancy Goldstone. ISBN 0-7679-0837-6.
• Michael Servetus: Intellectual Giant, Humanist, and Martyr by Marian Hillar, 2003. ISBN 0761824006.
• The Case of Michael Servetus: (1511–1553 : The Turning Point in the Struggle for Freedom of Conscience) by Marian Hillar, 1997. ISBN 0773485724.
• The Heretics: Heresy Through the Ages by Walter Nigg. Alfred A. Knopf, Inc., 1962. (Republished by Dorset Press, 1990. ISBN 0-88029-455-8)
• The History and Character of Calvinism by John T. McNeill, New York: Oxford University Press, 1954. ISBN 0-19-500743-3.
• Bonnet, Jules (1820–1892) Letters of John Calvin, Carlisle, Penn: The Banner of Truth Trust, 1980. ISBN 0-85151-323-9.
• Find in a Library with WorldCat. Contains seventy letters of Calvin, several of which discuss his plans for, and dealings with, Servetus. Also includes his final discourses and his last will and testament (April 25, 1564).
• Jules Bonnet, Letters of John Calvin, 2 vols., 1855, 1857, Edinburgh, Thomas Constable and Co.: Little, Brown, and Co., Boston—The Internet Archive
• The Man from Mars: His Morals, Politics and Religion by William Simpson, San Francisco: E.D. Beattle, 1900. Excerpts from letters of Servetus, written from his prison cell in Geneva (1553), pp. 30–31. Google Books.
• A complete translation of Christianismi Restitutio into English (the first ever) by Christopher Hoffman and Marian Hillar was published on April 30, 2007.[1] [2]
• Michael Servetus, Heretic or Saint?

Are those enough or you want more?

First of all, you got the wrong impression. I didn't say anything that your lifted material is edited, though it doesn't mean that I am completely sure that everything stated there is right. I used to work for an SEO company and, yes, I used to edit some pages of Wikipedia. If you can do some research in Google, you would discover that there are some people who have become victims with wrong data written in the Wikipedia page. It's a human-edited encyclopedia. As long as you have access, you can manipulate any page you want. That's why if you want to provide some information, it would be best if you settle for independent websites, not Wikipedia, because it's not reliable. If you don't believe that, well, that's not my problem anymore.

If you feel slighted with what I said, though, then I'm sorry, because that wasn't my intention. Don't think that this is just for you too. This is for everyone, who gets to visit your thread.

[Gotterdammerung.2]

First of all, you got the wrong impression. I didn't say anything that your lifted material is edited, though it doesn't mean that I am completely sure that everything stated there is right. I used to work for an SEO company and, yes, I used to edit some pages of Wikipedia. If you can do some research in Google, you would discover that there are some people who have become victims with wrong data written in the Wikipedia page. It's a human-edited encyclopedia. As long as you have access, you can manipulate any page you want. That's why if you want to provide some information, it would be best if you settle for independent websites, not Wikipedia, because it's not reliable. If you don't believe that, well, that's not my problem anymore.

If you feel slighted with what I said, though, then I'm sorry, because that wasn't my intention. Don't think that this is just for you too. This is for everyone, who gets to visit your thread.

I will ask you one more time. Give me your proof that the data were manipulated.

sorry to say , your reaction shows your lack of knowledge in General Christian history. My advice, get at least a bird's eye view about church history start in the reformation period.