How to stop or solve the poverty in the Philippines?

[SioDenz]

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education...para balu ang mga pinoy kung kinsa jud ang
botaran nig election...dili kay mag base ra sa TV ad ug sa suhol...

Mao sad, pero if walay tarong sa nagpa pili bro?

[unsay_ngalan_nimo]

double post...

[SioDenz]

Maayu ni pabasahun si pres gloria arroyo ani inyu lalis dah, hehe

[unsay_ngalan_nimo]

Of course hes not an economist. He just told you his grades in his "M.A. Economics" program didnt he?

Or did you even read his book wherein he wrote that.

You suffer the same errors again Unsay Ngaln
1. You believe everything the internet you read withou critical thinking.
2. you assume many things without proof
3. You dont read the basic (THE BOOK itself)
4. You dont use use your common sense and attacks the personalityh of the author and not his ideas.

I am NOT crtizng you as a person, it is your process of argument and debate that i disagree.


And did you even realize, that if he is a formal economist then he will be thinkiong like you and will not be able to invent his own idea called Hyperwage?

he probably read hundreds of book more than the ordinary econ graduate does, and has even disagreed with what he found and invented his own theory.. a theory like gravity, that is used to explain an already existing phenomenon.



Mr Ngalan, you havent so far presented any original idea of your own. unlike the hyperwage inventor
so stop maligning or critizing the the person.. focus on ideas.

Like what I told Al1974 it is useless to debate with uinformed debaters like you . (uninformed on the topic being debated)

Im sure you are a good political scientist as I have seen in your postings so far.

actually i do have my own idea base on hyperwage sir, and i was being critical of his work so far... i think.. hahahaha... he is a frustrated economist.. hahahaha.. he never got his diploma in MA.. hahaha.. dont tell about grades sir... they dont represent well of the ideas and intellect of a person... and i do think mr.bentulan is intelligent...

actually i do have an idea base on hyperwage sir.. and its selective hyperwage.. why selective? we must only increased the wage of those who are actually needed in the community.. hahahaha... we give more to the teacher so that our teachers wont work as domestic helpers in hong kong, we give higher salary to those nurses working in rural areas so that we wont have shortage in nurses...

you're the one who is not being critical...

i do agree with some points in Mr. Bentualan's book..

by the way i do think Mr. bentualn should also take into consideration Wallerstein theory of core-periphery..

and why IMF and WB policy are that way.. we must look onto who holds actual power behind WB and IMF.. in truth sir the US president can actually nominate a person to be WB president... in some ways we can still say that WB and IMf is implementing Beggar thy neigbor polcy, especilly when they pushed for globalization especially with the third world states sir...

furthermore i think that Mr.bentulan actually forgot that there are some goods that are normally cheaper here and expensive there or expensive and cheaper even in the first world because of non-econ reason but basically policy reason...

now sir why i think that mr.bentulan's econmic theory is not applciable in the real world and better stay in as an academic topic is beacsue it lack ther eal touch of of international relation and poltics vis-a-vis economics.. and it also lacks social research sir...

now im not questioning his expertise in econ sir merely his expertise in human nature and reason and policy making...

[foolonthehill]

Hello Tarmac.

You miss the point, again!!!

I will say this in simple words.

You miss the entire point of CK and its relation to Hyperwage Theory.

Conventional economic theory as used by Makati Business Club and all companies in third world countries:
" DO NOT INCREASE WAGES BECAUSE THE ECONOMY WILL BE DESTROYED"

Hyperwage Theory, in explaining the CK controversy:
"THE 19% INCREASE IN WAGES DID NOT DESTROY THE ECONOMY BY THE SAME AMOUNT OF NEGATIVE 19%"

that is the point.

Slight increase is actually freebie, gravy, bonus. The most critical aspect is that the economy was NOT destroyed. Not destroyed, not destroyed by the same amount.

therefore: The conventional economic theory is proven wrong.

And in fact, Tarmac, when you received your 13th month day in Decembers,

did the companies complain that they are out business during december? No, they enjoy the best season of the years.

Did the govt complain about the 13th month pay? No, the collect the biggest tax collection of the year.

Did the employees complain? No, of course not.

Who is complaining? Nobody?

Theoretically, it is just logically following the GDP equation. What is the most important part of the GDP equation?

Tarmac, simple logic, simple common sense, very real proof, everyday life.

Hyperwage is NOT an "academic" theory. It is a theory used to explain what is economically going on around us everyday.

Remember my posts ealier about Newton? Read it.

Hello Fool,

My, my. If there's one thing you've taken to heart from the Hyperwage paper is it is to denigrate the intelligence of people who disagree with it or at the very least ask questions about it. Not exactly the best way to advocate something, is it?

You obviously didn't read my post correctly. Why? Too many words for you?

I'll spell it out for you.

Mr. Bentulan said in Chapter 17 (sorry to disappoint you, I actually read the entire paper) that CK1994 shows an increase in wages led to a slight increase in employment. He did not just say, as you think, that it did not destroy the economy, he actually said it actually led to an increase in employment.

To quote Mr. Bentulan in Chapter 17: "I must make this distinction: A slight increase in wages (18.8 % in the case of New Jersey) will lead to a slight increase in employment as found by the CK 1994 study."

and

"When I read CK for the first time, my mind leaped and jumped with joy. Here was an actual study of an actual wage increase that resulted in an increase in employment. At that moment, I knew I was in the right direction. But then again, I was bereft of any economic education enough to be credible to economists."

and

"Thus, on two occasions, in 1992 and in 1996, the Card-Krueger studies confirmed that the increase in minimum wages did not result in huge unemployment, instead it resulted in slightly faster increases in employment."

My issue with those statements is that there is the possibility that the increase in employment was due to other factors, namely accelerating economic activity brought about by a rise in consumer credit (among other things), rather than a rise in minimum wage itself. It is hard to prove that hyperwage alone contributed to the rise in employment figures.

He says CK1994 validates hyperwage. You say Res Ipso Locquitor. I say it doesn't necessarily do that. I simply meant to say CK1994 should not be taken in isolation but properly contextualized.

And dismissing the issue of CK1994's validity or lack thereof as a single leaf in a vast forest is a major cop-out. If CK1994 doesn't validate hyperwage historically, then Mr. Bentulan has to date no empirical study to point to that would say hyperwage works in the real world.

And sorry to disappoint you again, I understand non-linear equations perfectly. But where does that even figure in my post? How is it relevant? We don't even have to talk about that. You've been harping about Istoryans here not understanding non-linear equations so you're stuck in that mindset. The moment someone questions hyperwage, you immediately say "you don't understand non-linear. Non linear this, non linear that..." like some broken record.

Did you just bring that up to sound smarter or intellectually superior?

Perhaps the non-linear nature of price vs wage is the only other thing you've learned from the hyperwage paper aside from hostility and arrogance towards people critical of the theory.

Clever, but clever by half. Try harder next time. Sorry.

And the sad part here (for you) is I'm not even questioning hyperwage in its entirety. I enjoyed reading the paper tremendously. Do I agree with everything he says? No. I still believe implementation will be a bitch. Especially in a third world country like the Philippines.

[foolonthehill]

No empirical proof?

Use your common sense.

- ALL first world countries are hyperwage countries

- Pinoys (even doctors of medicine and doctors of economics) go the US and first world countries because of high pay. (doctors working there as nurses). Teachers go to Taiwan as maids

1 out of every 10 pinoys are in first world countries leaving the children pregnant and drug addicted.

Isnt taht proof for you, or you are going to use another cover up explanation for that.

If you still insist there is no empirical proof, then I give up on you.

Some times there are students who just cant pass the subject, and it is a reality.

And some pass the subject bec they understand right away.

Einstein, Keynes, etc. they were all ridiculed bec at first everybody thought their ideas were wrong.

Now, even china is keynesian (i got this from bentolan too)

Have you analyzed the affordability index invented by him showing how many hours it takes to work for gasoline? that's the real world analysis of whether we are cheap or not.

then Mr. Bentulan has to date no empirical study to point to that would say hyperwage works in the real world.

[foolonthehill]

Can you enroll in MA Political science if you have not met the required min. requirement of knowledge. and you ridicule by laughing at his not finishing his MA Econ?

actually i do have my own idea base on hyperwage sir, and i was being critical of his work so far... i think.. hahahaha... he is a frustrated economist.. hahahaha.. he never got his diploma in MA.. hahaha.. dont tell about grades sir... they dont represent well of the ideas and intellect of a person...

[foolonthehill]

Plato was not a philosopher. He invented philosophy!

John Nash won a Nobel Prize in Econ bec he used his knowledge of math. He is not an economist.

A human being is capable of anything. You can invent a theory or a gadget even if you are not formally educated in that field. Edison.

Formal education is merely preparatory.

Dont let formal education ruin your brain. If you find it logical and self evident then that is true.

bentolan did not finish his MA but it is obvious he studied economic theories so much that he can highlight why the current economic theories and their respective implementation policies are in the wrong direction, and will continue to be in the wrong direction.

That is why Bentulan say, people call him crazy, but he risked his reputation (if ever he has any) to analyze why third world countries like Phils, are poor and will be poor for the next 5 years, then another 5 years.

Instead of bashing his theory, we should support his theory and whatever doubts you have you help him overcome it.

So far, like AL1974 who is highly educated, and is a currently a manager of company, I have found the theory very powerful, self-consistent, and explains many events that ordinary economic theory cannot

How do your ordinary economy theory explain and correc these?
why are bright people leaving this country? brain drain?
why are teacher working as maids in Hong Kong?
why does it take longer working time for pay for a liter of gasoline in the phils, than in the UK?
why does it take a shorter working time to in France to pay for electricity.
etc etc etc etc..

Hyperwage explains all of these in a simple, self-evident, logical, common sensical way. You dont even need to be an economics student.

bentolan is not a PhD in economics, he invented his own economics.

And you, Mr Ngalan, will benefit from the increase in purchasing power bec it will affect all of the workers and the non-workers in the Phils, and the entire Third World economy.

he is a frustrated economist.. hahahaha.. he never got his diploma in MA.. hahaha.. dont tell about grades sir... they dont represent well of the ideas and intellect of a person...

[foolonthehill]

I certainly in agreement with your al1974.

It is well designed, well-argued concept and it is so logical, you can punish yourself for not having thought of it in the first place.

The teachers now will get a P20T minimum wage! That is hyperwage theory being implemented.

Will the teachers say, no, we will not accept the new min. salary bec it will destroy the economy?

This Hyperwage thing is a well-thought of concept. With my years of experience in my job and with my educational background, I believe this Hyperwage Theory does make sense and is doable.

[al1974]

Daw? WHo said? You believe him? have you read teh boook and make a judgment for yourself?

And then, if nOT hyperwage, what policy do you want?

The one we have been foolowing since 50 years ago? and still we are thirdl world country?

So how many years do you need to make Phils a First World? an extension of 5 years, or 10 years ? HOw many?

Or maybe the current policy is wrong?

And hyperwage is the solution?

FYI mga bro- some companies are already realizing (without even reading the Hyperwage Theory) that in order to keep their company afloat (meaning- survive and maintain being the no.1 in their industry), they have to give better and COMPETITIVE salaries. Nowadays- competitive salary not only means to be competitive in the region or in the country for that matter, they sometimes gauge it against other developed countries. That is hyperwage in process!

Also- our government is also realizing this- there were news that their salary scheme will be reviewed and have to be increased substantially.

We have to note that our minimum wage at nearly 300 pesos a day is no longer enough- It can not even feed a single soul properly. The minimum survival (survival-meaning para lang mabuhi) salary is around 700-800 plus already. Hyperwage is the answer!