MERGED: CPP-NPA-NDF Discussions (Issues, Updates, etc.)

[giddyboy]

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yup but it was only a newsprint... i think sa inquirer ata to ako nakit-an or sa manila times. that was wayback last year. but i'll try to find it.

ah ok...let me know when u do...tnx in advance.

ngano gud mo stoop ko sa ilang level? it's just a waste of time. let them think what they want to think.

huh? is that pride? it's somehow ironic that u go for human rights but is not acting on it...anyways, sorry for the personal question...if i were in ur shoes, i will report that to the dean and the commander of that battalion...ka hilas!

[radiostar]

ah ok...let me know when u do...tnx in advance.

huh? is that pride? it's somehow ironic that u go for human rights but is not acting on it...anyways, sorry for the personal question...if i were in ur shoes, i will report that to the dean and the commander of that battalion...ka hilas!

still trying to find it sir...

yes it's personal pride, i did report it sa president sa school, pero until karon wala man gihapon actions gikan sa school... shagitan raman mig "i've been to mendiola, so don't educate me" ppffffffftttt. then about sa military, walay gamit. talking about military pppppppffffffftttttt

[gareb]

apologies for the late reply.

i say "effective venues" coz we have the best laws in the world, although not a law is perfect, and also the implementation...why resort to extremism, communism, or "messianic complex" at this moment? militant attitude maybe be the more wise approach. and it has been proven by our party-list system of governance.

simple observation would render the "effectivity" of those venues false. i need not emphasize on how tilted the justice system works, or how the party-list system, though noble in their intentions, has been continuously marginalized by the mainstream politicians. "best laws" indeed, but they are useless if they are not implemented properly.

and who are we to deny that this kind marginalization to legitimate issues can be a cause for this supposed-extremism? is it not prudence to first analyze and address the root-causes of this 'extremism', to better understand the dynamics behind it, instead of falling into the tar pits of stereotyping and black propaganda?

so yes, "extreme" is used relative to the point of our perspective...but whose perspective? it should be based on the perceived political center of the society...

at first glance, that is a sound suggestion. until you begin to look at who and what the "political center" really is, as well as what it has been doing, if indeed the policies that it accept are really "centrist" in orientation. it would also be worthy to ask who and what nexus of power influences the "political center" into doing what it does.

study their thesis and social analysis? we doubt if ever they have one

i believe you sorely need to acquaint yourself with how the broad Left, as well as the different factions within it, sees and analyzes the whole national situation.

less than 6,000 armed members against the total phil. army population, and still decreasing. no wonder they are profusely trying to recruit more thru all kind of media nowadays...and that includes the internet. now, analyze that.

don't ask me, but history will tell us that revolutions have been won for less. but really, as i have mentioned in countless posts in different threads, it's none of my business if they win or lose, what i care about are the kind of policies that will be implemented by this government, or theirs if by a very long shot they win.

not to mention that they are using party-lists allegedly as fronts for their cause as a more wiser political approach, thus infiltrating the gov't system.testing its validity & objectivity? their objectivity to extort, kill, and sow terror. that's why they suck right then and there.mas maayo pa nang MILF ky ang ilang goal & objective is to have a one-mindanao autonomy, not the already obsolete Maoist principles.and i'm saying "obsolete" coz it has a valid ground...

very hasty generalizations.

and besides, it does not need one to take into context to understand what the message conveys. Just based from the title itself: "Advance the struggle against the Arroyo regime"...no matter what is contained in that message is preceded by a titling that is MISLEADING and PREJUDICIAL in the first place.

strange. i take the message into context and i perfectly understand what the message conveys. and for most parts i agree with it.

it exposes (with propagandistic flair, of course) certain anomalies with the arroyo administration that we all are very much aware of, centering on how these affect the youth. tuition fee increases, inflation, unemployment, etc. this assertion is something whose truth value is, at best, certain. and if judged only for this, then the message has value.

it urges the youth to have a deeper understanding of the social problems that plague us. to take action by political pressure in any means. to participate in how policies are created to ensure that these policies will serve the interests of the people. that is perfectly fine with me, and something that i believe you will find agreeable with.

it just so happens that it also describes the different paths that certain youths take as a form of political pressure. some join the CPP-NPA for various reasons, that is a reality. mentioning this fact serves the interest of the organization, obviously, as this is their means of how they put political pressure to accomplish their aforementioned goals. but this is not even the centerpiece of the whole message as i read it.

many of us will not agree at the means of how the CPP-NPA accomplishes its goals. but there is no denying the fact that many of their analysis of how the society works is valid. we do not like the terminologies that they use, only to find out later that we actually mean the same thing, only using different words.

the message urges the youth to do something about the current social situation, and not be dummies to what goes on in the world. we do it our way, they do it theirs, anything but apathy. please do not denounce the whole message just because you do not agree with the political ideology of the messenger.

[mOnOzErO]

Unity is the Key. We don't need to oust the present goverment, instead we make ways to be helpful. Pirmi na lang ta gakontra sa tanan nga nakalingkod. eversince nga natawo ko, wala nay undang ang pagkontra sa gobyerno. unsaon pag asenso kung puro lang ta hinaway.

[gareb]

And I just said , who do you respect ? Like I said , I speak generally because I am for the GOVERNMENT whoever it is and thats is how I support it . You are speaking specifically to PRESIDENT GLORIA MACAPAGAL ARROYO and only to her . Now who are those people whose motives are for the common good ? Remember the song " PEOPLE are PEOPLE " ?

you conclude that because i mentioned of questionably elected officials, i was referring to GMA. and you also mentioned you support the government. "who are those people whose motives are for the common good ?" well, you made the connection between GMA and being "questionably elected" didn't you? enough said.

It might sound like that but since when will a PRO GOVERNMENT ( in a sense where LET IT BE and not a FANATIC ) will agree with an ACTIVIST and ANTI GOVERNMENT or far worst an advocate of COMMUNISM . Korehi-i na lang ko .

when one establishes himself wrong (as i pointed out above) and still goes on and proclaim himself right, that my friend is what i we all call "fanatic".

Hahaha .. Gareb .. Gareb ... you are the only one who ASSUMED that what I said is the only WAY . I even asked you if you have more lay it down . Just because I said a couple of things , it stops there . Dont go deep when the fishes are in the surface .

forgive me. the fishes are indeed in the surface. because they are floating dead, belly up. guess whose fishes are they?

Just because you respect means you are harboring also ? Just because you are supporting means you are also pretending to be BLIND and DEAF ?

sorry again, i am so dumb. i did not know that you can harbor such complex logic as you made me assume that the fishes are in the surface. unsa ba jud? haha.

you criticize me for "making assumptions" and then you criticize me for "not making assumptions". mao nay LOLZ. haha.

LOLZ .... when I said that , did I give you names , provinces of their jurisdiction and position in the government ? Now you ASSUME too much .

now i am assuming too much again. haha.

[giddyboy]

"best laws" indeed, but they are useless if they are not implemented properly.

exactly what i said...best laws (and no law is perfect)...and the implementation...blah, blah, blah.

but not trusting our justice system in the first place and not partaking on helping to strengthen it in one way or another in our own capacity gives it a bad taste in the mouth. after all, we, the people is the gov't.

and who are we to deny that this kind marginalization to legitimate issues can be a cause for this supposed-extremism? is it not prudence to first analyze and address the root-causes of this 'extremism', to better understand the dynamics behind it, instead of falling into the tar pits of stereotyping and black propaganda?

well, i am not denying that...it's a sad reality...but ideologies leading to it has a lot of factors. we can't even pinpoint poverty or oppression as the only causes. but PROPAGANDA has a lot to do with it. it's a kind of MAGNET...and it's even one of the main objectives of guerrilla warfare.

we should not forget also that foreign entities sympathetic and collaborative to their causes doesn't leave the whole equation...

at first glance, that is a sound suggestion. until you begin to look at who and what the "political center" really is, as well as what it has been doing, if indeed the policies that it accept are really "centrist" in orientation. it would also be worthy to ask who and what nexus of power influences the "political center" into doing what it does.

that's exactly what i mean...u just expounded it. but still this depends on one's perspective. but asa man diay ta base, di ba sa majority?

i believe you sorely need to acquaint yourself with how the broad Left, as well as the different factions within it, sees and analyzes the whole national situation.don't ask me, but history will tell us that revolutions have been won for less. but really, as i have mentioned in countless posts in different threads, it's none of my business if they win or lose, what i care about are the kind of policies that will be implemented by this government, or theirs if by a very long shot they win. very hasty generalizations.
strange. i take the message into context and i perfectly understand what the message conveys. and for most parts i agree with it.

i'm only referring to "communism", not "broad left" which i am not in the position to acquaint w/ in the first place...

it exposes (with propagandistic flair, of course) certain anomalies with the arroyo administration that we all are very much aware of, centering on how these affect the youth.

now, u even observed it (exposes with propagandistic flair). but not that way unta in my own perspective...and that is my main point.

tuition fee increases, inflation, unemployment, etc. this assertion is something whose truth value is, at best, certain. and if judged only for this, then the message has value.
it urges the youth to have a deeper understanding of the social problems that plague us. to take action by political pressure in any means. to participate in how policies are created to ensure that these policies will serve the interests of the people. that is perfectly fine with me, and something that i believe you will find agreeable with.
it just so happens that it also describes the different paths that certain youths take as a form of political pressure. some join the CPP-NPA for various reasons, that is a reality. mentioning this fact serves the interest of the organization, obviously, as this is their means of how they put political pressure to accomplish their aforementioned goals. but this is not even the centerpiece of the whole message as i read it.

of course, kinsa goy wa kbalo ana gud. ang akoa lang concern is the "propagandistic flair" of the message.

and i already reiterated my point "to take action by political pressure in any means" is not thru extremism or other forms of ideology like communism. militant attitude i see is more appropriate...

many of us will not agree at the means of how the CPP-NPA accomplishes its goals. but there is no denying the fact that many of their analysis of how the society works is valid. we do not like the terminologies that they use, only to find out later that we actually mean the same thing, only using different words.

really? well, btaw, communism worked well in China & North Korea...but in the Phils, i don't think so.

the message urges the youth to do something about the current social situation, and not be dummies to what goes on in the world. we do it our way, they do it theirs, anything but apathy. please do not denounce the whole message just because you do not agree with the political ideology of the messenger.

sorry but i stick to how i see it. the message is MISLEADING, PRE-JUDICIAL, and PROPAGANDISTIC. that is why i am denouncing the whole message...and i know that there is some truth in there, but the messenger can do better than that.

[gareb]

but not trusting our justice system in the first place and not partaking on helping to strengthen it in one way or another in our own capacity gives it a bad taste in the mouth. after all, we, the people is the gov't.

if the a set of laws continously marginalize a people, if a justice system continues to be inutile and defeats the very purpose of its existence by being used primarily as a tool to maintain the imbalance of power, who are we to blame the victims when they have learned not to trust in it, as much as they have given up on those who hold power?

because this is the case; the government has ceased to serve the interest of the people, plain and obvious. it has the mandate of the people, yes, but that does not translate that the government will automatically represent the people's interests. besides, i need not go on about how our elections go and who and what kind of people gets the only chance of being elected into power.

we can't even pinpoint poverty or oppression as the only causes. but PROPAGANDA has a lot to do with it. it's a kind of MAGNET...

true, it is 'propaganda'. but political propaganda, advertising, pulpit preaching, 'information campaigns', mass media, and everything else that attempt to shape public opinion is worthless, empty and ineffective if it does not somehow reflect current realities. it is precisely because they base their analysis on factual observations (however mistaken their analysis or the solutions that they prescribe may be) that makes them stubbornly stick.

that's exactly what i mean...u just expounded it. but still this depends on one's perspective. but asa man diay ta base, di ba sa majority?

where to base our perspective? simple. the interest of the people. the opinion of the people may run counter to their interests - it is not always that the opinion of the majority is right, and you know that. and i bet you know very well how the opinion of the majority is influenced and swayed against their very interest.

i'm only referring to "communism", not "broad left" which i am not in the position to acquaint w/ in the first place...

it may surprise you that "communism" and the "broad Left" have so many things in common. in fact, "communism" is but a faction of the Left. there are significant ideological differences between the factions within the Left, but their similarities outweigh their differences.

i hope this is not another knee-jerk reaction to the word "communism", as demonized by many who support its opposite ideology. this kind of reaction does not in any way help to understand what this is all about.

really? well, btaw, communism worked well in China & North Korea...but in the Phils, i don't think so.

the use of terms and concepts like "equality", "social justice", "social emancipation" and "liberation" aren't just monopolized by supposedly democratic countries you know. it should also be worthwhile to see how the term "democracy" is defined, used and applied among countries with supposedly different political systems.

and i already reiterated my point "to take action by political pressure in any means" is not thru extremism or other forms of ideology like communism. militant attitude i see is more appropriate...

perfectly fine. so now it seems that you agree with the gist of the whole message, sans the whole "propagandistic flair". the CPP-NPA might not agree with you on how you view communism, but it is certain that you are not their enemy.

now, u even observed it (exposes with propagandistic flair). but not that way unta in my own perspective...and that is my main point. of course, kinsa goy wa kbalo ana gud. ang akoa lang concern is the "propagandistic flair" of the message.

sorry but i stick to how i see it. the message is MISLEADING, PRE-JUDICIAL, and PROPAGANDISTIC. that is why i am denouncing the whole message...and i know that there is some truth in there, but the messenger can do better than that.

it is after all a political bulletin, propagandistic flair is a given. same with pulpit preaching, product advertising, government press releases (but not mainstream media, as it still pretends to be 'balanced and unbiased').

personally, i hate it too. but as an attempt at critical thinking, these things should pose as challenges. it is precisely because we attempt to think critically that this kind of loquaciousness should not affect how we view the gist of the message. taking the message 'as is' in these situations where propaganda is involved is to fall into a trap where there can only be two possible reactions; blind obedience or utter contempt.

i'm crossing my fingers that you are not one of those who fell in.

[SPRINGFIELD_XD_40]

you conclude that because i mentioned of questionably elected officials, i was referring to GMA. and you also mentioned you support the government. "who are those people whose motives are for the common good ?" well, you made the connection between GMA and being "questionably elected" didn't you? enough said.

Because we have to limit ourselves within her perimeter because that is what the TOPIC is all about right ? Right . PGMA was linked to QUESTIONABLE ELECTED OFFICIALS because if you only stop beating the bush ... mao na gipasabot nimo . of course that is old news .

BTW ... you admire those public officials whose goals are for the common good ? DO we have one ? LOLS ... Kinsa ?

when one establishes himself wrong (as i pointed out above) and still goes on and proclaim himself right, that my friend is what i we all call "fanatic".

One can always say he/she is WRONG if itss not conforming to his or her objectives . True ... but by you just saying AS I POINTED OUT ABOVE that you are WRONG doesnt make you right and I am wrong and vice versa . Unless someone insisted on something that he or she knows is wrong , that is a form of ESTABLISHING that makes him or her a FANATIC .

forgive me. the fishes are indeed in the surface. because they are floating dead, belly up. guess whose fishes are they?

CPP-NPA ?

sorry again, i am so dumb. i did not know that you can harbor such complex logic as you made me assume that the fishes are in the surface. unsa ba jud? haha.

Gareb ... again Gareb .... think ! Yoiu are smarter than that if you dig . What do you call yourself Gareb ? I am pretty sure you are not an ANTI PGMA because you are not a FANATIC . Are you one of those who just observes and then blances and checks them on a personal level just like the PROS and supporters ?

you criticize me for "making assumptions" and then you criticize me for "not making assumptions". mao nay LOLZ. haha. now i am assuming too much again. haha.

Huh ?!? Refresh me por pabor .

[Tamblot]

Oh my! Philippines. It seems for years, each and every person who sits on that presidential chair are subject to this "struggle against president regime"

Who put this person into power in the very first place? As long as the people continue to be fooled and moved by bribes during election, then never expect a decent person to lead the country.

Now, somebody put themselves in that position right now, being the president and having all the intention for the good of the country. Can you stir the economy around overnight? Can you eliminate all these corruptions and crimes and terrorism for just a day. Nobody can!

Instead of uniting for a better Philippines, there is the tendency to go into factions, driving each and every personal agenda into the spotlight.

The problem is not the government. Its about the culture and attitude of the people. No single person can change all this. Never! Unless everyone would collectively decide to change.

[gareb]

BTW ... you admire those public officials whose goals are for the common good ? DO we have one ? LOLS ... Kinsa ?

you should be the one to answer that, you are, after all, the self-proclaimed supporter of the government.

One can always say he/she is WRONG if itss not conforming to his or her objectives . True ... but by you just saying AS I POINTED OUT ABOVE that you are WRONG doesnt make you right and I am wrong and vice versa . Unless someone insisted on something that he or she knows is wrong , that is a form of ESTABLISHING that makes him or her a FANATIC .

geez. u did not get it.

CPP-NPA ?

geez, that's twice already.

Gareb ... again Gareb .... think ! Yoiu are smarter than that if you dig . What do you call yourself Gareb ? I am pretty sure you are not an ANTI PGMA because you are not a FANATIC . Are you one of those who just observes and then blances and checks them on a personal level just like the PROS and supporters ?

strike three, you're out. haha.

Huh ?!? Refresh me por pabor .

i'm too lazy. sue me.