Discussion on the Christ Jesus.

[dartzed]

---

28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

RC ruman forgot that Jesus Christ is GOD 100% and was Flesh 100% that time. therefore as GOD HE is co-equal, Glorify the SON as you Glorify the Father, does it ring a bell?

Positionally that time(flesh) Jesus Christ was not equal to the father for HE became flesh and dwells amongst us.
Please don't forget, nagpakatao si Christ.

hahaha mao jud mulusot nsad na cya...

[geoseph]

So in summary, Trinity means one God - meaning one in purpose, while being 3 separate personages God the father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. "Distinct from one another". Correct bai?

Maddox bai, I'm hoping this can help.

As I dig deeper regarding this, it appears that these official stand by the Vatican rests on decades or centennials of philosophical reasonings (debates). The official stand is based on several philosophical considerations, and so you have layers of philosophical ideas behind it.

I think a priest would best answer your question.

I am guessing what they mean. My view of the official stand is that there is only one God. They also believe that God is a Trinity but, the nature of this remains a mystery since, this belongs to the realm of God who is beyond all of us. However, for the Trinity to stand, the three persons have to be distinct else, if they are not then, there is no Trinity to begin with. The most they will admit to the nature of the Trinity is that what differentiates the three from each other is their relative relationship with each other (one is the father of the other, the other the son, and so on...). By being differentiated only by a relative relationship, the necessity of them being of one essence or substance will not violated at the same time.

And so, I conclude that the official stand rests on very safe assumptions. Any further venturing will be met by the answer of it being a mystery of God and is hence, beyond all of us, including them.

To answer your question if they are of one purpose, I think they should. I also think this would also be the stand of any Christian religion that believes in the Trinity. Here's a quote, if it may help:

Luke 11:18-20

18 If Satan also is divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand? Because you say I cast out demons by Beelzebub. 19 And if I cast out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your sons cast them out? Therefore they will be your judges. 20 But if I cast out demons with the finger of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you.

Regarding them having three separate personages. I have to clarify with you what you mean by 'personages.' Thanks.

[maddox]

@geoseph

Thanks for your explanations bai.

By 'personage' I mean being an individual. Being distinct and separate from others in body, soul, and conciousness. (sakto ba ako definition?)

Anyway, referring to the Godhead or Trinity, in your case, I mean God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost are 3 diffirent individuals. They are separate and distinct like you and me.

That Jesus Christ is literally God the Father's son and not just a 'version' of Himself in the flesh. He acts under the Father's direction. He is the mediator between God the Father and man through the Atonement. His role is to save us from our sins through the Atonement and pave the way to help us return to the Father's presence.

That the Holy Ghost is the third member of the Godhead. He is not Jesus Christ nor God the Father in the spirit, but he is a divine individual whose role is a messenger, testifier, one who manifests to men that Jesus is the Christ and that we are all God's children, and that Jesus Christ is the only way to return to our Father's presence.

That God the Father is the supreme and highest member of the Godhead. He is the supreme God. Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost acts under His direction. He doesn't take the form of Jesus Christ nor the Holy Ghost, never have and never will because He is distinct as Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost are distinct. He loves us because we are His children and His whole plan of salvation is to help us to return to His presence through the Atonement of Jesus Christ.

---------------------

On a personal note, I don't think this is one big mystery. It's plain and simple. God did not intend this to be mysterious to us. He wants us to love Him. How can we love Him if we don't know Him?

Mystery is what the adversary uses to confuse us.

[Oakboy]

Bro sa Jewish mindset kung mo ingun gani ka nga Son of God ka boot pasabot equal ka sa Ginoo or better term for that is ikaw mismo ang Gnioo. So pag ingun niya nga I and the Father are one is really admitting His Godship.

aw mindset na diay ni sa Jewish...kato kahang uban mi claim nga GOD sila o' son of GOD noh? sa panahon ni JEsus Christ...kato sab lost years ngano kaha wala to ma record noh? dihay tiguwang babae ay sa Pasay City Terminal membro sa usa pud ka christian denomination, akong pangutana about the lost years iyang tubag kai lisod na kuno "kai mo baga og samot ang bible" pag ka tubaga kana hehehe! ang naka pasamot sa pangutana diha sa kataas sa 13 ka tuig wala gyud maski usa sa panghitabo kabahin sa iyang kinabuhi ma sulat, maski inspirational nalang unsaon nato pag sunod sa iyang mga ginabuhat?

[IdontCare]

post niya? ako question, gikan ba sa bible iya gipangpost? maypa ka kay agree ka sa wala sa bible.
here read this:

In the Trinity, the Three are said to be co-equal and co-eternal, one in essence, nature, power, action, and will.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity
this is their explanation because Trinity can't be found and wasn't explained by the bible.
Christ said that:

28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.
John 14:28
So they are not equal in any aspect.
still you're not certain "basin". let the bible speaks not our own interpretation.
Then I've given you the link and definition.
Then you're obligation is to show meaning of Trinity that they are not equal in power/authority(according to you).

Peace!

Aw bible verse diay imong gi pangita, naa man na sa bible. Ang ang naman mag pataka ug himo himo ug word nga trinity ang mga church fathers nga walay support gikan sa bibliya, timan.e mas BALAAN pa ni sila kay nato. So mak huna huna nalang ta nga mahadlokon jud ni sila sa Ginoo so lisod kaau para nila magtumo tumo kay hadloik sila sa Ginoo.

Bro equal in power na sila pero not in authority.

[IdontCare]

aw mindset na diay ni sa Jewish...kato kahang uban mi claim nga GOD sila o' son of GOD noh? sa panahon ni JEsus Christ...kato sab lost years ngano kaha wala to ma record noh? dihay tiguwang babae ay sa Pasay City Terminal membro sa usa pud ka christian denomination, akong pangutana about the lost years iyang tubag kai lisod na kuno "kai mo baga og samot ang bible" pag ka tubaga kana hehehe! ang naka pasamot sa pangutana diha sa kataas sa 13 ka tuig wala gyud maski usa sa panghitabo kabahin sa iyang kinabuhi ma sulat, maski inspirational nalang unsaon nato pag sunod sa iyang mga ginabuhat?

kuyawa gud anang bayhana.

wala to masuwat bro kay wala may significant nga nabuhat si Jesus. Then wala pa man sab to siya nagsugod sa iyang ministry.

[rcruman]

Aw bible verse diay imong gi pangita, naa man na sa bible. Ang ang naman mag pataka ug himo himo ug word nga trinity ang mga church fathers nga walay support gikan sa bibliya, timan.e mas BALAAN pa ni sila kay nato. So mak huna huna nalang ta nga mahadlokon jud ni sila sa Ginoo so lisod kaau para nila magtumo tumo kay hadloik sila sa Ginoo.

Bro equal in power na sila pero not in authority.

I love to see a verse from anyone that saying "equal in power na sila pero not in authority".

bro, claiming is one thing but proving is another thing.
SHow verse directly, kay kung naa pa hagbay ra nimo gipakita.

Peace!

[necrotic freak]

Those who deny Divinity of Jesus are compelled to deny the Divine nature of Holy Spirit! For them Trinity of God is beyond human understanding! So deny it! They just forget the fact; God who created man can never be a slave of human intelligence! For them Holy Spirit is only an angel or one of the seven spirits! They try to confuse Trinity as Tri-theism (Three-gods!) Criticize Catholics as ‘Trinitarians’ Did God reveals Himself as ‘Trinity’ in the Bible? How do we understand this Great Mystery?

The term 'Trinity'
As we all know Divine Revelation is explained through the centuries by some theological terms, though those are insufficient to explain the truth revealed, in depth! We can never find the word ‘Bible’ in an authentic translation of the Bible. Bible itself is a term that appeared in history from the 4th century! But we believe in It.! Similarly, we don’t see the word Trinity in the bible, but to explain the Divine Mystery revealed to us about God the Father, the Son and The Holy Spirit, we use the term ‘Trinity’.
The word trinity is 1st used by St.Theophilus of Antioch in his book ‘Epistle to Antolycus’ in A.D 180(Greek: triados) Remember, at that time there was no ‘bible’ in the Church! In fact the term Trinity is more ancient than the word ‘bible’ itself! Before the formation of the Bible those who worked behind the creation of a canonical book ‘bible’, believed and accepted ‘The Trinity’ as God’s
revealed truth handed over to them from the apostles! After some years Tertullian (A.D 160-250) used a Latin term for Trinity (trinitas) in his work ‘Modesty’. He wrote” Trinity of the one Divinity; Father, Son and Holy Spirit”


HOLY TRINITY IN THE NEW TESTAMENT
Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father in union with Jesus. John 15:26 – “But when the Comforter comes, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceeds from the Father, he shall testify me.” Bible uses the Greek word ‘pneuma’ (pnyoo’-mah’) for Holy Spirit, which means ‘breath’ or ‘life giving spirit’. When God created man He ‘breathed’ on Adam and gave him life. Jesus breathed on apostles and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit” (Jn. 20.21) Holy Spirit is the Breath of the Father and The Son, who is proceeding from both of them!
Jesus himself reveals the unity and equality of three persons of Trinity when he commanded: Mathew 28:19 “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” Here the ‘name’ singular is used for the plurality of “Father, Son and the Holy Spirit “(not the plural ‘names’). This singular ‘name’ implies the fundamental unity of Three Divine Persons. Those who deny divine nature of Jesus and The Holy Spirit are baptizing their members “In the name of the Father, the God, Son the man, Holy Spirit an angel.” Through baptism God, who is the Trinity, chooses us. I Pet 1.2: “who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ”.
St. Paul explains this mystery more clearer when he says: “ There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit, there are different kinds of service, but the same Lord, there are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men” (1Cor: 12.4). The creative work of Heavenly Father, the redemptive work of The Son and sanctifying work of The Spirit are same work of the Almighty.

[dartzed]

I love to see a verse from anyone that saying "equal in power na sila pero not in authority".

bro, claiming is one thing but proving is another thing.
SHow verse directly, kay kung naa pa hagbay ra nimo gipakita.

Peace!

OT: hehehe maau jud au ka patuyok sa sturya bro.. bilib nakonimo jud...

hahaha..

nice...

[rcruman]

OT: hehehe maau jud au ka patuyok sa sturya bro.. bilib nakonimo jud...

hahaha..

nice...

this is just all you've got?

Peace!