Are we saved by faith alone, or do we need works, too?

[SioDenz]

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lol.. your grammar sucks..

Sorry wa na review or banga lan jud..

true faith? murag banda haha.. as far as i know the Thread Started did not specify as to the kind of faith he was talking about, but based on the fact alone that he compared it to work, then the reader can only assume that's it's entirely separate, therefore it's gotta be faith alone, at least that's how i understood it,.. cguro mabaw na para nimo, but im just trying to relate to the topic..

Lihay na

niabot kag atake sa protestantism nya karun off topic na kay di nman ka makatubag?

Tubaga daw.. unsaon pagka consider nga TRUE FAITH is Muatago rakas Langob nya mag Cge rag AMPO?

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sio unsaon di ie pagsabot sa true faith?

ikaw nlan akong pangutanon:

Matawag ba nimu nga tinood nga pagtoo if WALA ka kaila sa imung Gituhoan nya WALA ka kabalo Kinsa siya, unsa iyang Gusto ug SUGO?

[slabs17]

Lihay na

niabot kag atake sa protestantism nya karun off topic na kay di nman ka makatubag?

Tubaga daw.. unsaon pagka consider nga TRUE FAITH is Muatago rakas Langob nya mag Cge rag AMPO?

lihay man sad lagi ka sio?

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ikaw nlan akong pangutanon:

Matawag ba nimu nga tinood nga pagtoo if WALA ka kaila sa imung Gituhoan nya WALA ka kabalo Kinsa siya, unsa iyang Gusto ug SUGO?

ayw kog tubaga ug pangutana sio. wala pa gani ko nimo tubaga nangutana na noon ka tubag sa. Lol

[buchokoy]

Yeah, its basically my Point that Faith and Good Works is ONE and NOT separate

Theres No verse in the BIBLE that say or Jesus sad there are instance that YOU will have TRUE faith But cannot be seen on your actions. thats why when people say i have FAITH, you can tell if its True Faith based on their Action, The reason for that is Because - THEY ARE NOT SEPARATE

Now question, So you Believe Good works is a SEPARATE Requirements aside from FAITH?

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So thats how you understand FAITH?

FAITH is NOT JUST MEAN BELIEVE.

FAITH is ang PAGKINABUHI ni KRISTO... TRUE FAITH diay nang di musunod sa Sugo sa imung GITUHUOAN? dunay diay gi ingun si KRISTO nga if Dunay kay Pagtoo, OK ra nga MUTAGO ka sa langob nya mag ampo ra?

mabawa gud sa imung pagsabot sa word FAITH...

You didn't answer my question. So saying FAITH ALONE is WRONG, do you agree now?

[SioDenz]

lihay man sad lagi ka sio?

Mao bitaw nay Explanation.

di ka kasabot sa meaning sa pangutana? Nganu cge lagi kag Post ug verse sa una nga mao man nay Style sa pag send sa message sa Bibliya?

so wa ka kasaabot sa imung gipang post sa una?


Matthew 16:1-4
The Pharisees and Sadducees came to Jesus and tested him by asking him to show them a sign from heaven.
2 He replied, “When evening comes, you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is red,’ 3 and in the morning, ‘Today it will be stormy, for the sky is red and overcast.’ You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of the times.[a] 4 A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.” Jesus then left them and went away.

So based sa imung Analogy, Nilihay si Kristo sa pangutana? kay wa man gi direct ug tubag

[Jhared]

Sorry wa na review or banga lan jud..



Lihay na

niabot kag atake sa protestantism nya karun off topic na kay di nman ka makatubag?

Tubaga daw.. unsaon pagka consider nga TRUE FAITH is Muatago rakas Langob nya mag Cge rag AMPO?

that was just an example, kay niingon man ka nga faith results to good works, but in fact you can be full of faith but do nothing like living a life of solitude in a cave or the mountains, like what old century monks did before, to them it's what they think is right to express their faith to their god, but according to saint siodenz it's not true faith, please enlighten us holy one..

to answer your question you have to give me your own definition of true faith kay karon pako kadungog ana, ang banda ra akong nahibaw-an.. where do we draw a line between faith and true faith?

[slabs17]

Mao bitaw nay Explanation.

di ka kasabot sa meaning sa pangutana? Nganu cge lagi kag Post ug verse sa una nga mao man nay Style sa pag send sa message sa Bibliya?

so wa ka kasaabot sa imung gipang post sa una?


Matthew 16:1-4
The Pharisees and Sadducees came to Jesus and tested him by asking him to show them a sign from heaven.
2 He replied, “When evening comes, you say, ‘It will be fair weather, for the sky is red,’ 3 and in the morning, ‘Today it will be stormy, for the sky is red and overcast.’ You know how to interpret the appearance of the sky, but you cannot interpret the signs of the times.[a] 4 A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.” Jesus then left them and went away.

So based sa imung Analogy, Nilihay si Kristo sa pangutana? kay wa man gi direct ug tubag

sa ato pa si Jesus na di ie ka ron Sio? si Jesus ang ang gipangutana kaniadto...karon ikaw ang akong gipangutana

ayaw lagi kog pasopoti ug pangutana sa akong rasad nga pangutana...tubaga sa ko sa akong pangutana "UNSAON DI IE PAG ILA SA TRUE FAITH?" kana lang simpol ra diba?

[SioDenz]

that was just an example, kay niingon man ka nga faith results to good works, but in fact you can be full of faith but do nothing like living a life of solitude in a cave or the mountains, like what old century monks did before, to them it's what they think is right to express their faith to their god, but according to saint siodenz it's not true faith, please enlighten us holy one..

to answer your question you have to give me your own definition of true faith kay karon pako kadungog ana, ang banda ra akong nahibaw-an.. where do we draw a line between faith and true faith?

Good works is the manifestation of TRUE FAITH. imung pagtoo Makita sa imung buhat or Mu resulta ug maayung buhat.

It seems youre Confuse already

You first said Good works are REQUIRED for salvation nya KARUN imung example is Supporting the FAITH alone Belief of the Born Again

ASA Man jud ka?

True Faith or FAITH is just the same, adding the word TRUE is just to emphasize that we are talking about the same Faith Not Faith that being CLAIMED...

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sa ato pa si Jesus na di ie ka ron Sio? si Jesus ang ang gipangutana kaniadto...karon ikaw ang akong gipangutana

ayaw lagi kog pasopoti ug pangutana sa akong rasad nga pangutana...tubaga sa ko sa akong pangutana "UNSAON DI IE PAG ILA SA TRUE FAITH?" kana lang simpol ra diba?

LOL assumption... SO NILIHAY si Kristo WALA?

So since atung sundun ang paagi sa bibliya KRISTO nata...haha

Basaha ang James 2:14 pataas dunay explanation didto..

[Jhared]

Good works is the manifestation of TRUE FAITH. imung pagtoo Makita sa imung buhat or Mu resulta ug maayung buhat.

It seems youre Confuse already

You first said Good works are REQUIRED for salvation nya KARUN imung example is Supporting the FAITH alone Belief of the Born Again

ASA Man jud ka?

True Faith or FAITH is just the same, adding the word TRUE is just to emphasize that we are talking about the same Faith Not Faith that being CLAIMED...

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im not supporting anything, you're not getting it...

if true faith and faith is the same, then how come you are always making a distinction between the two? and how can we tell if a certain faith is true faith?

[jarves]

Are we saved by faith alone, or do we need works, too?

That is the question posted in this thread. The root word there is ALONE. Is it sufficient and self sustaining enough to be alone that all other else are neglected? Let's start by how protestants interpret Faith Alone since the reformation and how Catholics interpret it since the apostolic era.

For Protestants you can't point to one definition of faith alone. This is because various denomination has his own interpretation.
These are their interpretations that I know of:
1. Faith Alone means faith does not need work. Meaning we are justified by our faith because our works are filthy rags, a dung covered in snow. They go on to say that the flesh is to no avail.
2. Faith (genuine) produces good works. Good works is the product of True Faith. In Catholic layman's term this means Faith and Works. But they do not want to sound catholic so they use this wordings. This basically is the thought of catholics interpretation. They just do not use the words "Faith AND Works". They replace the word AND with PRODUCE. Which are both different. They just do not like the word AND.


For Catholics:
Faith and Works go together. St. James compares it to a Body without a soul. Faith without works is dead.

When debating against a protestant this happens. IF their denom supports number 1 and it is refuted, then they will shift to number 2. They freely jump from one denom's interpretation to another just to try to refute the catholics but to their useless effort. That is why catholics say that protestants always refute themselves because in the end they will sound catholic and thus refuting what they believe in. I saw John Piper refute himself.

James is very clear in his writtings. Perhaps God gave him a prophecy that faith will be used ALONE in the future or maybe there where some sects who are already practicing it during that time that is why he refuted it in his writings.

It is very clear, Faith does not always produce good works. May it be genuine or not. Nowhere in the bible does it say that we are judged according to the level of our faith because it produce good works. Faith produces works is just another manipulation of words in order to trick people into thinking that faith will always produce good works.

They falsely assume that the catholic church teaches that catholics must earn their way into heaven. Or try to quantify how many good works must be needed in order to go to heaven. Nowhere in the Catechism of the Catholic Church states that. In fact it is condemned. It's just another lie spread by various protestant sects. Some protestant sects judge the catholic church by the bad catholics in the church. This is not a the basis of identifying the church of christ. Even in christ little church (his band of apostles) there was judas. But people still follow jesus despite of what judas did.

So, are we saved by faith alone? The answer is no! We are saved by the mercy, love and grace of God. Faith and Works is our response to that.

[SioDenz]

you're not getting it...

if true faith and faith is the same, then how come you are always making a distinction between the two? and how can we tell if a certain faith is true faith?

Because anybody can CLAIM they Have FAITH but actually its Not a TRUE FAITH because it cannot be Seen on what they DO... like what James 2:14+ said.

so Basically to Differentiate the 2 for the sake of the conversation, i add the word TRUE to emphasize the later...

Only God can decide who has True Faith. all we can DO as Human is to see it in their deeds. that's the only thing we can do and its Not even enough to Judge them... we can only say Based on the Bible...