MERGED: Cebu BRT (Bus Rapid Transit)

[Vundaboi]

Supplemental ra man gihapon ang nature sa BRT, unless daghanon jud sa city ang order sa coaches.

LRT is a pipe dream kay mahal ra jud kaayo, and I doubt musugot ang national government mu subsidize ug dako kaayo na amount for infrastructure na wala sa NCR.

A subway/rapid rail transit system would be nice, but in this country, maayo nalang ang any kind of progress kay sa wala.

[cliff_drew]

stupidity is NOT DOING ANYTHING AT ALL even if the possibilities are there.. Only a FOOL DEEMS IT AS IMPOSSIBLE if he has a backward thinking of making it only for the present, not Looking outward on the

bigger picture.. in this case.. for the LONG TERM FUTURE.

That's what I have pointed out. No possibilities for LRT -- now or in the future. Why? There are 3 items to consider. First, in regard to LRT proposals, the latest one submitted was rejected by NEDA after it failed their standards. For a proposal to pass NEDA, proponent(s) should show financial and economical viability. All of those proposals failed to justify the financial side thus none was approved after not meeting the two required criterias. From what I've known, the firm (project proponent) assigned to do the MRT-LRT project in Cebu had an estimated cost of US$602 million or roughly P27 billion for setting it up. Yet this same firm has only the capability to build but no source of funding. If you're in the NEDA, will you accept theirs without thinking twice?

Second, if given that they have funding of construction, how about the cost it will entail in the coming years? Will it acquire the necessary ridership to justify the cost? Still, none of the LRT proposals have justified these criterias. LRT in Metro Manila is subsidized by the national government but BRT is expected to be self-reliant, which means that Cebu City will be the one to shoulder the maintenance yet it will be an income generating transport system to the city. So win-win to Cebu City.

Third/Lastly, political will. Before a project will be implemented, it has to pass several nods. In the local aspect, both the mayor and city council should approved it. In the national aspect, it has to go through DOTC then to NEDA then to the President (as chair of NEDA) being the last say. BRT took 2 years (after the submission of the pre-FS) before getting an approval from the President. It was once rejected by Pnoy but sooner get his impression after the proponents showed him the Proof-of-Concept (POC).

My question to you is, how many years will you wait for LRT to materialized? 25 years? 50 years?

again, feasibilities are mere case studies, I don't know who conducted these case feasibiity studies but I do know that whatever they did, they are not thinking in the long run of doing these studies at all.

You undermine the FS? If only the LRT proposals (or feasibility studies) passed to NEDA then no problem at all. But logic states that even the 4 proposals submitted didn't pass NEDA standards, would you still recommend it? Who's not thinking forward now? Who would fund a project that is impossible to make because in the first place its a loosing money?

BRT is a CHANGE alright.. but for a SHORT CHANGE only... that's what we filipinos like to do more.. what we see today, is what we try to patch up only.. not thinking what we can really MIGHT DO to resolve it PANG LONG TERM.

BRT merely a SHORT SIGHTED VIEW of looking it for a change... if you want to make it for LONG TERM.. I advocate still A FAST TRAIN TRANSIT.

If you look at it, why go for a transport system that is not feasible? I myself want an LRT but having known the reasons then I understood why. We can't always DREAM and get what we want. We have to be realistic not only to present but also to the future. Ridership requirement alone will kill that DREAM. The very reason why World Bank or any international entities would NOT fund this DREAM project instead funded the BRT system which is cheap and more cost-efficient system.

[jeff_bonz59]

If you look at it, why go for a transport system that is not feasible? I myself want an LRT but having known the reasons then I understood why. We can't always DREAM and get what we want. We have to be realistic not only to present but also to the future. Ridership requirement alone will kill that DREAM. The very reason why World Bank or any international entities would NOT fund this DREAM project instead funded the BRT system which is cheap and more cost-efficient system.

bottomline.. its not that its not feasible... ITS JUST THAT THERE ARE TOO MANY RED TAPES AND BUREAUCRACIES that prevents this from happening.

Like I've said, if there's a WILL there's a WAY.... sad to note lang nga ang uban natong mga CEBUANOS are too narrow minded and shortsighted to LOOK ON WHAT'S BEYOND the WALL...Mag MINTINIR LANG sa unsay pagka KARON.... WALAY PANGLANTAW SA UGMA...

and PS... BRT is yes CHEAP because we want to solve a problem in CHEAP WAY lang... parehas ra nag pag tinarbahog BALAY nga basta BAROG lang OK NA NA... W/o ever checking if d ba ni MALUMPAG if mag LINOG, walay consideration sa structurability ug maau ba pagka plano... MAAU KAU Ta ana.. basta makasulit lang...

COST EFFICIENT ang BRT... but is it environment friendly ba pud?? is it FAST AND EFFICIENT BA SAD? considering atong mga dalan dire sa Cebu gagmay.. naghuot ug traffic na gani kaau ang mga dalan JEEP PALANG NA.. how much pa kahag mga buses na ang modagan dire.. add that to the current Jeepneys nato karon + taxis and private cars... tanawn natog MAKALIHOK ug MAKAABOT PA BA KA SA IMONG destination give and take ang TIME..

I agree with you man sad bai drew.... I just don't see the point of having BUSES plying out ever CONGESTED STREETS na daan.. We need a LONG TERM SOLUTION, NOT just a FLY BY NIGHT SOLUTION lang.. kay ang population sa CEBU NAGKA DAKO taga TUIG ug every year daghan mga sakyanan na ang managan sa dalan PERO ANG KADAKO SA DALAN MAO RA GHAPON.

WE NEED A FIXED AND DIRECT LONG TERM SOLUTION bai... that's how I SEE ON RESOLVING this issue.

[anubiz]

buss will do anf murag mas safe ang buss kaysa jeep。。 what do u think guys？

[cliff_drew]

bottomline.. its not that its not feasible... ITS JUST THAT THERE ARE TOO MANY RED TAPES AND BUREAUCRACIES that prevents this from happening.

Like I've said, if there's a WILL there's a WAY.... sad to note lang nga ang uban natong mga CEBUANOS are too narrow minded and shortsighted to LOOK ON WHAT'S BEYOND the WALL...Mag MINTINIR LANG sa unsay pagka KARON.... WALAY PANGLANTAW SA UGMA...

and PS... BRT is yes CHEAP because we want to solve a problem in CHEAP WAY lang... parehas ra nag pag tinarbahog BALAY nga basta BAROG lang OK NA NA... W/o ever checking if d ba ni MALUMPAG if mag LINOG, walay consideration sa structurability ug maau ba pagka plano... MAAU KAU Ta ana.. basta makasulit lang...

COST EFFICIENT ang BRT... but is it environment friendly ba pud?? is it FAST AND EFFICIENT BA SAD? considering atong mga dalan dire sa Cebu gagmay.. naghuot ug traffic na gani kaau ang mga dalan JEEP PALANG NA.. how much pa kahag mga buses na ang modagan dire.. add that to the current Jeepneys nato karon + taxis and private cars... tanawn natog MAKALIHOK ug MAKAABOT PA BA KA SA IMONG destination give and take ang TIME..

I agree with you man sad bai drew.... I just don't see the point of having BUSES plying out ever CONGESTED STREETS na daan.. We need a LONG TERM SOLUTION, NOT just a FLY BY NIGHT SOLUTION lang.. kay ang population sa CEBU NAGKA DAKO taga TUIG ug every year daghan mga sakyanan na ang managan sa dalan PERO ANG KADAKO SA DALAN MAO RA GHAPON.

WE NEED A FIXED AND DIRECT LONG TERM SOLUTION bai... that's how I SEE ON RESOLVING this issue.

It's not that I'm narrow-minded bai. As what I've said, I'm also for LRT but dili lagi feasible for Cebu. And I don't see bureaucracies or red tapes. Both LRT and BRT proposals were presented to NEDA but only the latter passed the test. Source of funding hagbong na daan, unsaon man papasar ana. Asa man ang bureaucracy, red tape ana? Ang proponent sa LRT wala gyud ka defend sa ilang proposal kay mao lagi walay funding. Bisag mga local investors walay mosukol ana. Laliman ka adto sa bukid agi. Kinsa may manakay sa bukid? Kinsa may negosyante mosukol ug negosyo nga in the first place lugi na daan. Unlike sa BRT nga moagi sa main roads thus ang required ridership (passengers) kay ma achieve gyud. Ug regarding sa huot ang dalan, tan-awa tong link akong gi post diri guide to nimo unsay expansion nga buhaton sa main roads.

Ingon ani ra man gud. Kung feasible pa lang ang LRT, in business side, naa untay daghan mo fund ani nga project. Why man need pa ug mga investors? Kay dili man makaya sa budget sa Pilipinas. BRT pa lang daan P10.62 billion na. Dili na kwarta sa mga Pinoy, gi loan ni from Agence Francaise de Development and the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development. How much more ang cost sa LRT. Mao ng cost-efficient ang BRT kay ang atong goals kay to lessen traffic and provide commuters the faster travelling time. Ikaw, will you invest say P30 billion for LRT when you can also achieve the goals in lesser amount of investment in BRT? Yes, short-term ra but ang effect ana is more or less ma feel sa public 2-3 years from now. Lesser traffic means higher human productivity. We had been longing for a mass transport system way back. And here, it came true since it will be operational by 2017. Buses to be used are environmental friendly and NEW so expected nga paspas. Dili na mga existing buses nato karon. Although dili na mawala totally ang jeepneys kay they will serve as feeders sa BRT. Pero kanang mga jeepneys with the same routes sa BRT kay hinay-hinayon nag wala. Sooner, private cars/vehicles and taxis nalay mahabilin.

So kanus-a kaha na ma materialized ang FIXED SOLUTION, 30, 50 years from now? Mas long-term pa ang subway kumpara sa LRT.

[jeff_bonz59]

It's not that I'm narrow-minded bai. As what I've said, I'm also for LRT but dili lagi feasible for Cebu. And I don't see bureaucracies or red tapes. Both LRT and BRT proposals were presented to NEDA but only the latter passed the test. Source of funding hagbong na daan, unsaon man papasar ana. Asa man ang bureaucracy, red tape ana? Ang proponent sa LRT wala gyud ka defend sa ilang proposal kay mao lagi walay funding. Bisag mga local investors walay mosukol ana. Laliman ka adto sa bukid agi. Kinsa may manakay sa bukid? Kinsa may negosyante mosukol ug negosyo nga in the first place lugi na daan. Unlike sa BRT nga moagi sa main roads thus ang required ridership (passengers) kay ma achieve gyud. Ug regarding sa huot ang dalan, tan-awa tong link akong gi post diri guide to nimo unsay expansion nga buhaton sa main roads.

Ingon ani ra man gud. Kung feasible pa lang ang LRT, in business side, naa untay daghan mo fund ani nga project. Why man need pa ug mga investors? Kay dili man makaya sa budget sa Pilipinas. BRT pa lang daan P10.62 billion na. Dili na kwarta sa mga Pinoy, gi loan ni from Agence Francaise de Development and the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development. How much more ang cost sa LRT. Mao ng cost-efficient ang BRT kay ang atong goals kay to lessen traffic and provide commuters the faster travelling time. Ikaw, will you invest say P30 billion for LRT when you can also achieve the goals in lesser amount of investment in BRT? Yes, short-term ra but ang effect ana is more or less ma feel sa public 2-3 years from now. Lesser traffic means higher human productivity. We had been longing for a mass transport system way back.

This is what I mean Bureaucracy bai... I know you based your statements on facts but I based mine on solely the fact sad nga those officials who tried to make a feasibility study DID NOT REALLY STUDIED the WHO, WHY, HOW'S AND WHEREFORS on the plan. You said adto manukad or moagi sa BUKID?

why naa pa diay BUKID ANG CEBU bai?? I don't know asa nga BUKID (nga imong giingon) sugdan nila.. BUT IF I can suggest, From MINGLA hangtod sa tumoy sa MANDAUE (BORDERLINE SA CONSOLACION man lang) bsag diha lang ang route sa LRT, daghan ug dako na kau nag katabang sa mga riding public... WHY? per stations spanning MINGLA, TALISAY, BULACAO, BASAK, SOUTH BUS TERMINAL, EMALL, USCMAIN, MJ CUENCO, MABOLO, hangtod na sa maabot sa last stop sa LRT... daghan na kau DILI ma late ana sa ilang mga trabaho or sa ilang work or skuyla.

AND Frankly I would rather go investing the $30 million for a wide long term project knowing nga in the long run MAGDUGAY JUD NI FOR THE NEXT 20 or 30 YEARS (kay sa akong gikaingon... nagkadako na jud ang population sa CEBU), INSTEAD OF INVESTING the $30 MILLION SHORT TERM FOR THIS BRT.. PERO ang CONSEQUENCES PUD, DI MABINBIN ANG KALABAD na sa TRAFFIC TUNGOD SA KAGAMAY SA MGA KADALANAN NATO.

And here, it came true since it will be operational by 2017.

Dates don't matter because every new incumbent public officials nga naa sa termino, DILI MOPADAYON USUALLY SA PREVIOUS PROJECTS SA NIAGING NIDAGAN nga public official.... Maghimo silag ilahang Projects pud.. sama ra na sa cgeg lungag sa mga kadalanan nato kay kunohay PUBLIC DRAINAGE system.. nya mahuman na gani, ig sunod election, naa napuy NAGLUNGAG, himo2x napud ug tapak2x.. its always been like that... A VICIOUS CYCLE nga DILI MAHUMAN BSAG KINSA PAY MOLINGKOD bai.

Pero kanang mga jeepneys with the same routes sa BRT kay hinay-hinayon nag wala. Sooner, private cars/vehicles and taxis nalay mahabilin.

I don't agree with you on this one bai... Jeepneys have long been always a mainstay even before pa... IN FACT when you go ABROAD, YOU CAN SEE POSTCARDS that SYMBOLIZES YOUR FROM THE PHILIPPINES IF YOU SEE POSTCARDS WITH JEEPNEYS on the PICTURE.... When you see a postcard where theres a Jeepney on it.. YOu KNOW STRAIGHT THERE AND THEN that THAT PICTURE IS FROM THE PHILIPPINES... That's a GIVEN FACT na.

Wala man gani ka wagtang ang mga kadagkoan sa MMDA sa Manila sa Jeepneys (instead they've implemented the color-coding scheme nalang) DIRE PA KAHA SA CEBU?

Don't you think kadakong gubot naman lang "hinay-hinayon nag wala" ang mga Jeepneys, esp sa mga drivers pud nga mao ra nay ilang nailang trabaho sukad2x pa sa ilang mga katiguwangan sad?

AND Don't you think eradicating the PUJ's and replacing them with BRTs would ultimately resolve the burgeoning issue of traffic? especially to our COMMUTERS? Mas angay pa gani dungagan kay sa kuhaan dba?

So kanus-a kaha na ma materialized ang FIXED SOLUTION, 30, 50 years from now? Mas long-term pa ang subway kumpara sa LRT.

SUBWAY IS NOT A LONG TERM SOLUTION BECAUSE MOST PARTS OF CEBU ARE FLOOD PRONE man... mas maau pa mo construct ug OVERPASS RAILWAYS para sa LRT rather than SUBWAYS nga BAHA-AN LANG NYA DAYON2x.

[vulture08]

MRT much better samot ang traffic pag Bus ang modaghan diha sa CEBU. Gamay raba kaau ang mga kalsada diha. Mga bus ang main cause sa traffic diri sa EDSA.

[amingb]

Puede rang BRT pero inig ka human butangan pud MRT .. siaro ma late pata ana ....

[vipvip68]

a flyover perhaps maorag sa bangkok skyscrapercity or og baga2x ila face demolish ang mga establishment behind

i dont think mu uyon mga cebuanos with elevated roads.. supak na man gani ug flyover... and were not even factoring the cost of such a project.

Frankly, the only way is road widening because dili gyud ni pwede nga ma 2 lane (1 way on each side) nalang ning Escario until Gov. M. Cuenco/ banilad road

[cliff_drew]

This is what I mean Bureaucracy bai... I know you based your statements on facts but I based mine on solely the fact sad nga those officials who tried to make a feasibility study DID NOT REALLY STUDIED the WHO, WHY, HOW'S AND WHEREFORS on the plan. You said adto manukad or moagi sa BUKID?

Wait. Government officials aren't the one responsible in doing feasibility studies, what they will be doing is to approve or reject a proposal. Thus I asked you if you undermine the studies made by experts who made the feasibility studies namely, Schema Konsult, Inc. and Jefferies of the US.

why naa pa diay BUKID ANG CEBU bai?? I don't know asa nga BUKID (nga imong giingon) sugdan nila.. BUT IF I can suggest, From MINGLA hangtod sa tumoy sa MANDAUE (BORDERLINE SA CONSOLACION man lang) bsag diha lang ang route sa LRT, daghan ug dako na kau nag katabang sa mga riding public... WHY? per stations spanning MINGLA, TALISAY, BULACAO, BASAK, SOUTH BUS TERMINAL, EMALL, USCMAIN, MJ CUENCO, MABOLO, hangtod na sa maabot sa last stop sa LRT... daghan na kau DILI ma late ana sa ilang mga trabaho or sa ilang work or skuyla.

Here's the LRT proposal made way back. To quote "The first phase is the 21-kilometer LRT from Mandaue City to Talisay City. The second phase is the MRT from Talisay City to Dalaguete town in the south, while the third phase will be from Mandaue City to the Sogod town in the north." Where do you think asa na agi?

AND Frankly I would rather go investing the $30 million for a wide long term project knowing nga in the long run MAGDUGAY JUD NI FOR THE NEXT 20 or 30 YEARS (kay sa akong gikaingon... nagkadako na jud ang population sa CEBU), INSTEAD OF INVESTING the $30 MILLION SHORT TERM FOR THIS BRT.. PERO ang CONSEQUENCES PUD, DI MABINBIN ANG KALABAD na sa TRAFFIC TUNGOD SA KAGAMAY SA MGA KADALANAN NATO.

Mao lagi. Ang dakong pangutana, asa man kag investors? 4 proposals na ang niagi pero bagsak sa requirements kay lagi dili financial viable. To think, walay gusto ug lugi nga negosyo.

Kanang mga infrastructure projects nato most of them are Build-Operate-Transfer (BOT). Meaning, any company can invest their money to government projects and eventually make money out of it kay dili ka support financially ang government. It's clear in the name BOT: build, operate and then transfer. Transfer means say after 25 years, they will transfer the operation to the government. It depends on the contract.

Dates don't matter because every new incumbent public officials nga naa sa termino, DILI MOPADAYON USUALLY SA PREVIOUS PROJECTS SA NIAGING NIDAGAN nga public official.... Maghimo silag ilahang Projects pud.. sama ra na sa cgeg lungag sa mga kadalanan nato kay kunohay PUBLIC DRAINAGE system.. nya mahuman na gani, ig sunod election, naa napuy NAGLUNGAG, himo2x napud ug tapak2x.. its always been like that... A VICIOUS CYCLE nga DILI MAHUMAN BSAG KINSA PAY MOLINGKOD bai.

I don't think mahitabo na sa BRT project. Rama supported BRT. If he run again by 2016, still it will be continued. Or when Tommy replaces him, samot nga sya gyud original endorser sa BRT. Just give it a benefit of the doubt and hope.

I don't agree with you on this one bai... Jeepneys have long been always a mainstay even before pa... IN FACT when you go ABROAD, YOU CAN SEE POSTCARDS that SYMBOLIZES YOUR FROM THE PHILIPPINES IF YOU SEE POSTCARDS WITH JEEPNEYS on the PICTURE.... When you see a postcard where theres a Jeepney on it.. YOu KNOW STRAIGHT THERE AND THEN that THAT PICTURE IS FROM THE PHILIPPINES... That's a GIVEN FACT na.

Wala man gani ka wagtang ang mga kadagkoan sa MMDA sa Manila sa Jeepneys (instead they've implemented the color-coding scheme nalang) DIRE PA KAHA SA CEBU?

Don't you think kadakong gubot naman lang "hinay-hinayon nag wala" ang mga Jeepneys, esp sa mga drivers pud nga mao ra nay ilang nailang trabaho sukad2x pa sa ilang mga katiguwangan sad?

AND Don't you think eradicating the PUJ's and replacing them with BRTs would ultimately resolve the burgeoning issue of traffic? especially to our COMMUTERS? Mas angay pa gani dungagan kay sa kuhaan dba?

Let's limit the talk sa Cebu. You can't compare Manila here. When I said na soon mawala ang jeepneys, I clearly stated na its only within BRT routes. To quote "Although dili na mawala totally ang jeepneys kay they will serve as feeders sa BRT. Pero kanang mga jeepneys with the same routes sa BRT kay hinay-hinayon nag wala. Sooner, private cars/vehicles and taxis nalay mahabilin." Reportedly there are 3,000 jeepneys na ma displace according to a study by the University of the Philippines National Center for Transportation Studies. This is expected. However, as part of the plan, solutions will be in place to address this problem.

Asked how they will address this, Yap said among their plans is to reroute the jeepneys and use them as "feeders".

This means that the jeepneys will ferry passengers from areas where the BRT cannot go, to the BRT stations.

Using the jeepneys as feeders is among the five options identified by the DOTC in their Social Management Plan Final Report for the BRT project.

The other options include allowing the jeepneys to stay in their route, open new routes for them, cancel their franchise and allow them to apply for open franchises for other transport services such as trucks-for-hire or school service, or to allow jeepney drivers and operators to participate in the BRT operations.

France to lend P2.1B for BRT | Sun.Star

SUBWAY IS NOT A LONG TERM SOLUTION BECAUSE MOST PARTS OF CEBU ARE FLOOD PRONE man... mas maau pa mo construct ug OVERPASS RAILWAYS para sa LRT rather than SUBWAYS nga BAHA-AN LANG NYA DAYON2x.

If you like Overpass railways, fine. Each of us has our own choice man sad. Dili lang ko ka imagine unsay nawong ug asa na ibutang ug uyon ba mga Cebuanos ana. Kung flood prone lang ang reason para dili ma consider ang subway as a long term solution then I don't agree. Possible na sya, like you said, IF THERE'S A WILL THERE'S A WAY.