Are we saved by faith alone, or do we need works, too?

[NapoleonBlownapart]

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kay ang subject lagi sa kalowasan dako ang scope ana. losot pa jud ka oi. ingna na lang gud nga naglisod ka og tobag. di na pointless kong kasabot ka sa tobag og kong naa kay ikatubag.

Salvation man in a Christian POV gud basaha gud ang first post. Kung imo jud e insert ang non-christian POV aw ayaw nalang pag expect na makakuha ka ug same answer. Kung moana ka nga good works ra di na kinahanglan ang faith aw imo pud na inyo man nang pagtulon-an basta kay sa Christian point of view kinahanglan jud ang faith. Di na ka ana ka lalis kay lahi man imo point of view.

klaro kaayo nga naglisod ka og tobag.

yeah right.. suit yourself.. hahahaha

[marine77]

Bai, that was a hypothetical question.



Bai, if that's the case,then there's no point arguing about what is important. If it's faith or if it's good works coz only God knows. So all that was said by everyone is not sure, even the claim by some that faith is the only thing that is important.

I kinda agree that we really know nothing. Ang uban mn gud here murag feeling kaayo ngasweto, nga ila ng Ginoo ang sakto, nga ila nang mga beliefs ang sakto.

Brad wla man gihapon ka makasabot sa justification by faith.sa imong paminaw kung kuwang man ang work ni ginoong hesukristo sa cross,then pagbuhat ug maayo para ka maluwas kay dili ang imong intellectual capacity maoy basihan. Kung para sa mga christians nagtuo nga by faith alone maangkon ang kaluwasan,pasagdi sad sila kay confident man mi about sa among faith.

Ang among pagbuhat ug good works,overflow na sa among faith. Simple as that!dili nalang ta magpasweto2 sad kay sure ta nga ang ginoo ra ghapon tinuod ang mojudge sa atua in the end.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0A5F-KbVoo

[BigBadWolf]

TUBAGA daw akong pangutana:

Kung mag tithes ta ug 10% sa simbahan ug magsangyaw ta ug Biblia o atong ipadungog ang maayong balita sa katawhan (good works), makatabang ba kini sa atong salvation o Dili?

Klaruha kuno beh...

[BigBadWolf]

YES or NO ra man ang tubag ana...

[marine77]

saba diha oi mora sab kag nakabasa sa ilang works dah, hahaha. kay ako nakabasa ra ba ko. layo ra kaayo inyong doktrina sa doktrina sa Romano katoliko kay sa ila dool dool kaayo sa mga works sa mga church fathers ang inyo puerteng layoa.

Lisud kayo tubayan brad ang tawo nga wala makasabot sa kamatuoran kay puro ra rinasonay nga walay point ang mashare dri.pero kung buot hunahunaon,wala raba juy title nga naka atubang ug dagkong crowd nga ni depensa sa iyang belief,pasabot nga lang nga layaw ra ang imong nakat unan kay wala man sad kay mashare nga makapadasig sa tawo ngadto sa ginoo.puro raman linawgaw ng imoha.

Ai nalang pud ug tuga2,maypa magpuyo ka para dka maulawan.

[NapoleonBlownapart]

TUBAGA daw akong pangutana:

Kung mag tithes ta ug 10% sa simbahan ug magsangyaw ta ug Biblia o atong ipadungog ang maayong balita sa katawhan (good works), makatabang ba kini sa atong salvation o Dili?

Klaruha kuno beh...

Dili.. Good works kay evidence na sa imo salvation. Pero di na sya general rule ha kay naa man jud nang mag pakaaron-ingnon. Ang Dios ra nasayod kinsa na sila.

[BigBadWolf]

AHHH....MAO BA!!!

WOW.

so imong buot pasabot,, WALAY pulos na mo effort pa ko ug tithes og preach kung kini DILI diay makakatabang sa akong salvation kung kahibaw ko na naluwas na ko....

I preach daw ni sa inyong members para makahibaw cla...kay naa ko'y kauban na protestant wala daw cya kahibaw ani.

but take note brad wala gitudlo ang sola fide sa mga Kristiyano katong unang panahon ug bisan mag cross referencing kas doktrina sa mga ancient churches nga independent sa katoliko...ni start ra ang maong doktrina 500 years ago kay martin luther.

and btw, martin luther added the word "ALONE" sa Romans 3:28 na maong main basis sa Sola Fide.

He even went further to say that he can commit adultery and sin a hundred times as long as he has faith in God..kay kahibaw cya maluwas ra cya gihapon. So mao ni ang nag summarize sa teaching sa Sola Fide sa mga protestants.


Ug ikaw brad, mo agree ka ani?

“To lie in a case of necessity or for convenience or in excuse – such lying would not be against God; He was ready to take such lies on Himself” -- martin luther

[ketllac]

Hahaha.. tan-awa ra.. unsa d.i acceptable nimo na source ketllac? Layo ra imong analogy because Strong is a reputable source for meaning of lexicons, even Catholics use it as a source

basin assumption na sad ka da..did I say dili siya acceptable? ako giingon gamay rag validity kay labi na ang iya focus is text finder from Hebrew to English ug siya methodist nga theologian. ha daghan catholics nag qoute lang niya.. bai sa term paper ug research naa nay gitawag ug cross referencing....dili lang usa ka source, mas maayo pa gani neutral imo source..neutral diay na siya nga KJV man iya gi concord? ha gi-qoute diay tanan sa mga catholic theologians, nga mismo ang catholic naay university sa Jerusalem para ani..naay excerpt form catholic encyclopedia o..

Strong's "Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible" (New York, 1894) has reference only to the English text; for that it can hardly be improved, as it is extremely rare to find a text missing from Strong. As a text-finder, it is unsurpassed; but it lacks the special advantages of Young's signalized above.

source; CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Concordances of the Bible

Ikaw naa kay gipost na source sa imong mga claims?

naa o ang source kay neutral ---- Hebrew Word Meanings

The Hebrew root aman means firm, something that is supported or secure. This word is used in Isaiah 22:23 for a nail that is fastened to a "secure" place. Derived from this root is the word emun meaning a craftsman. A craftsman is one who is firm and secure in his talent. Also derived from aman is the word emunah meaning firmness, something or someone that is firm in their actions. When the Hebrew word emunah is translated as faith misconceptions of its meaning occur. Faith is usually perceived as a knowing while the Hebrew emunah is a firm action. To have faith in God is not knowing that God exists or knowing that he will act, rather it is that the one with emunah will act with firmness toward God's will.

[Turagsoy]

di mada ang faith alone.. wa tay pampalit pagkaon kung di ta mo work..

[redhorse1L]

Dili.. Good works kay evidence na sa imo salvation. Pero di na sya general rule ha kay naa man jud nang mag pakaaron-ingnon. Ang Dios ra nasayod kinsa na sila.

Ako lang neh i-base sa example, kay murag lisud kaayo sabton nang liko2x nga tubag:

When a convert (ex. Catholicism to Baptists) decided to receive Jesus as his personal Lord and Savior, he is already saved.
On the day of feast of ressurection, he received baptism. In his heart, he cried out that he rejoiced for his salvation.
He already let go of bad habits, vices and humbly asked forgiveness of the sins he committed.

Weeks passed, he's been an active churchgoer, participated in church activities like outreach programs and other social functions. He was able to do this things because of his genuine faith.. Every Sunday, he cries and shouts in his heart to thank the Lord for he has saved him.

Couple of years passed by, an unfortunate event happened.. His parent got sick and they are troubled financially.
He asked the Lord why all these things happened.. With faith, he prayed and asked the Lord for strength.
He felt good that his church circle are there to comfort and pray for him.

As pressure arises due to debt piling, emotions overpowered him.. Bought out a cigar just to ease his nervousness, and eventually got a bottle just to calm himself.
Day after day, questions are still circling to his mind and with cigar and liquor coming back into his system, anger, frustrations, sink in.. Now he started to skip Sunday services.

He engaged on a quick-money scheme kind of business but end up losing more money, building up frustration and anger.

At this point, he started to ask if God really heard his prayers..
When his parent died, he now asked if there is really a God..

From then on, things are different..



So, now.. is that person still saved?