Mam! Dad! Im sorry, Im gay!

[*dudes*]

---

agree w/ title
for the title. mao na ingon cya i'm sorry, i'm gay.
coz ang parents nagexpect normal ang anak nila.

kung ako ang father sukmagon jud nako ba.

well, b4 the father do it, he needs to think it twice first, why his son becomes gay? did he do his part to affirm his son as a man?

This is the question must be ask by the father's who has a son like that.

[aridoasis]

we'll if you agree with me or not, homosexuality is a sinful way of coping up what is missing in our life, within ourselves

what is sinful about being homosexualthat cannot be found in being heterosexual?

i believe that being homosexual is not sinful. it is the acts that executed in this state of being that are sinful. this could merely be a "gentile-or-Jew" scenario, or have we forgotten that, once upon a time, being a gentile meant being an outcast, a sinner, an exclusion from the "chosen people". yet, both sin in the same manner, the only difference being that one is gentile and the other is Jew.

do you have that big a grudge against the homosexual society to be indirectly calling them "dirty"?

[labyrinthbw]

@*dudes*

you are apparently blaming the parents if their son turns gay... i think that's unfair to the parents...
there are lots of factors contributing to the "gay-ness" of a man...

this leads me to thinking that you must be gay and that you're blaming your parents for it... why so?

[weedmeister2]

kung ako ang father sukmagon jud nako ba.

hehehe, reminds me of the time when i didnt have kids... i used to say that if ever i had a boy and he "turned" gay, i would put him inside a sack, hang the sack on a tree and beat it with a stick... hehehe
as of today, I have 3 boys.

if any of them came up to me and told me he was gay, i would explain to him the hardship and persecution he is going to face in life. but at the same time, i would reassure him that his mother and I will always be there, facing the hardships alongside him.

i have accepted that different people have different needs and different perspectives in life. who am i to dictate what they should be in life...? even i, being their father, do not have that right.

parenthood is a gift given by God. children are temporary gifts that God has graced your life with. i have no right whatsoever to enforce my beliefs and wants on them. as long as i have done my part in teaching them what is right and wrong, good and bad, the rest falls upon them.

anyhow, for all the homophobes, let me present you with an incomplete roll call of some of the more famous gays and lesbians in history (real and mythological):


Horus and Seth
Osaris and Seth
Gilgamesh and Enkidu
Most Spartan Men
All Cretan Men
Zeus
Poseidon
Apollo
Dionysus
Artemis
Athena
Pan
Achilles :mrgreen:
Patroclus
Heracles (Hercules)
Phraedrus 5thC BCE
Phaedo of Elis 5thC BCE
Socrates 469?-399BCE
Plato 427?-347BCE
Zeno of Citium c333-262BCE [Founder of Stoicism]
Chrysippus c280-207BCE [Stoic philosopher]
Apollodorus c.140BCE [Stoic philosopher]
Julius Caesar 100?-44BCE ["every women's husband, every man's wife]
Mark Anthony c.82-30BCE
Cicero 100-43BCE [
and Octavian/Augustus b.63-r.27BCE-14
Tiberius r.14-37
Caligula r.37-41(inter alia)
Nero r.54-68
Vespasian r.69-769
Titus r.79-81
Domatian r.81-96
Hadrian r.76-138
and Antinous d.130
Marcus Aurelius r.121-180
Elagabalus r.218-222
Catullus 84-54BCE
Horace 65-8BCE
Martial 40-103/4
Virgil 70-19BCE
Tibellus 55-19BCE
and Marathus
Ovid 43BCE-17
Juvenal c.early 2ndC CE
Petronius d.65 [wrote the "Satyricon"]
Plautus 250-184BCE
Seneca 4BCE-65
*St Anastasia the Patrician
*St Anna/Euphemianos
*St Apollinaria/Dortheos
*St Athanasia of Antioch
*St Eugenia/Eugnios
*St Hilaria/Hilarion
*St Marina/Marinos
*St Marina (2)
*St Matrona/Babylas
*St. Pelagia/Pelagios
*St. Theodora/Theodorus
*St. Euphrosyne/Smaragdus
*St. Papula of Gaul
*St Thekla
*St Hildegonde of Neuss near Cologne
[all the above women dressed and lived as men, usually monks]
*St Uncumber [a bearded woman saint]
St. Sergius
and St. Bacchus
*St. Perpetua
and *St. Felicity
St. Sebastian
St. Augustine of Hippo 4thC
St. Aelred of Rievaulx early 12C
St. Anselm of Bec late 11C
St. Paulinus of Nola 4thC
and Ausonius
Baudri of Bourgeuil 1046-1130
Pope Benedict XI 1020-1055
Pope Boniface VIII b.c.1235-r.1294-1303
[charged with "sodomy" by Philip IV of France]
Pope Julius II
Pope Sixtus IV 1471-1484
[contemporary diarist calims he made his barber a cardinal, because he was his lover's son!]
Pope Julius III 1487-1555
and the Prevostino
Donatello 1386-1466
Pietro Aretino 1492-1556
Pomponia Leto 1428-1498
Niccolo Machiavelli 1469-1527
Andrea Poliziano 1454-1494
Leonardo da Vinci 1452-1519
(and Jacopa Saltarelli,
Andrea Salaini,
Francesco Melzi,
Cesare da Sesto,
Giuliano Boltraffio)
Raphael 1483-1520
Michelangelo Buonarroti 1475-1564
and Tommaso Cavalieri
Giovanni Antonio Bazzi "il Sodoma" 1477-1549
Giambattista Marino 1569-1625 [writer]
Caravaggio 1573-1610
Benevenuto Cellini 1500-1571
Tasso 16C [writer]
Niccolo Capasso 17C [Neapolitan dialect poet]
Antonio Rocco mid 17C [wrote and account of gay love
"L"Alcibiade Fanciullo a Scuola" in 1652]
*St Joan of Arc c.1412-1431
and *La Rousse
and *Catharine de La Rochelle
King Richard I the Lion-hearted b.1157-r.1189-1199
Nicholas Udel 1505-1556
Christopher Marlowe 1564-1593 [first creator of lists of Queers!]
?William Shakespeare 1564-1616
Richard Barn(e)field 1574-1627
Lord Southampton 16C
Earl of Oxford 16C
Charles Arundel 16C
Francis Bacon 1561-1626 [scientist]
Anthony Bacon 1558-1601
DH Lawrence 1885-1930 [writer]
T.E. Lawrence (of Arabia) 1888-1935 [writer and soldier]
Somerset Maugham 1874-1964
Virginia Woolf 1882-1941
Laurence Olivier
Florence Nightingale
Aleister Crowley
Marquis de Sade
Camille Saint-Saens 1835-1921[composer]
Jean Cocteau 1889-1963
Anais Nin 1903-1977
Tsar Alexander I 1777-1825
Nikolia Przhevalsky 1839-1888 [explorer]
Peter Tchaikosky
Sergei Rachmaninov 1873-1943[composer]
Mikhaill Kuzmin 1875-1936 [poet]
G.V. Chicherin 1872-1936 [politician]
Rudolph Nuryev 1938-1993
Alexander Hamilton 1755-1804
J. Edgar Hoover 1895-1972
Eleanor Roosevelt
Truman Capote 1924-1984
Walt Whitman 1819-1982
Henry David Thoreau 1817-1862
Raplh Waldo Emerson 1803-1882
Janis Joplin


and many many thousands more... look them up :mrgeen:

[kiwiboy]

I don't see anything wrong with being gay...

isn't it morally wrong?

[*dudes*]

what is sinful about being homosexualthat cannot be found in being heterosexual?

i believe that being homosexual is not sinful. it is the acts that executed in this state of being that are sinful. this could merely be a "gentile-or-Jew" scenario, or have we forgotten that, once upon a time, being a gentile meant being an outcast, a sinner, an exclusion from the "chosen people". yet, both sin in the same manner, the only difference being that one is gentile and the other is Jew.

do you have that big a grudge against the homosexual society to be indirectly calling them "dirty"?

i dont have any grudge with homosexual society but rather i am pity them and i have compassion for them, homosexuality like other, has a reason why it exist, most people think that being homosexual is a person whom you are born with, but they are lot of people who are ignorant how homosexuality develops, whether it would be in part of a man or a woman, we should learn the scientific basis for this, homosexuality based on my research develops if the mother and the father never do their part in providing the emotional needs of a child, i believe parenting is not only happen but rather it is a skill that needs to be studied and learn, through books and seminars, and parents should be part of any support groups that will help them to be better parents.

[weedmeister2]

i think its natural... homosexuals exist even in the animal kingdom...

[*dudes*]

@*dudes*

you are apparently blaming the parents if their son turns gay... i think that's unfair to the parents...
there are lots of factors contributing to the "gay-ness" of a man...

this leads me to thinking that you must be gay and that you're blaming your parents for it... why so?

the parents have the great role for the development of a man and a woman healthy sexuality life coz they are the first influential people in the developmental stage of a boy or a girl

you mention that they are a lot of factors for making a person to be a gay, so what are those, have you research those factors?

the reason why i brought up this topic coz they are a lot of straight men who m i know never talk this issue, and i boldly discuss this thing on this thread, i consider this topic very relevant to our human lives, thats why i discuss it here

i dont blame parents or anybody here, i just would like to stress out the important of ones role in the development of ones being thats most parents taken for granted

and i am a straight guy who are daring to discuss this matter that most men are afraid to discuss[br]Posted on: November 14, 2006, 11:12:20 AM_________________________________________________

hehehe, reminds me of the time when i didnt have kids... i used to say that if ever i had a boy and he "turned" gay, i would put him inside a sack, hang the sack on a tree and beat it with a stick... hehehe
as of today, I have 3 boys.

if any of them came up to me and told me he was gay, i would explain to him the hardship and persecution he is going to face in life. but at the same time, i would reassure him that his mother and I will always be there, facing the hardships alongside him.

i have accepted that different people have different needs and different perspectives in life. who am i to dictate what they should be in life...? even i, being their father, do not have that right.

parenthood is a gift given by God. children are temporary gifts that God has graced your life with. i have no right whatsoever to enforce my beliefs and wants on them. as long as i have done my part in teaching them what is right and wrong, good and bad, the rest falls upon them.

anyhow, for all the homophobes, let me present you with an incomplete roll call of some of the more famous gays and lesbians in history (real and mythological):


Horus and Seth
Osaris and Seth
Gilgamesh and Enkidu
Most Spartan Men
All Cretan Men
Zeus
Poseidon
Apollo
Dionysus
Artemis
Athena
Pan
Achilles :mrgreen:
Patroclus
Heracles (Hercules)
Phraedrus 5thC BCE
Phaedo of Elis 5thC BCE
Socrates 469?-399BCE
Plato 427?-347BCE
Zeno of Citium c333-262BCE [Founder of Stoicism]
Chrysippus c280-207BCE [Stoic philosopher]
Apollodorus c.140BCE [Stoic philosopher]
Julius Caesar 100?-44BCE ["every women's husband, every man's wife]
Mark Anthony c.82-30BCE
Cicero 100-43BCE [
and Octavian/Augustus b.63-r.27BCE-14
Tiberius r.14-37
Caligula r.37-41(inter alia)
Nero r.54-68
Vespasian r.69-769
Titus r.79-81
Domatian r.81-96
Hadrian r.76-138
and Antinous d.130
Marcus Aurelius r.121-180
Elagabalus r.218-222
Catullus 84-54BCE
Horace 65-8BCE
Martial 40-103/4
Virgil 70-19BCE
Tibellus 55-19BCE
and Marathus
Ovid 43BCE-17
Juvenal c.early 2ndC CE
Petronius d.65 [wrote the "Satyricon"]
Plautus 250-184BCE
Seneca 4BCE-65
*St Anastasia the Patrician
*St Anna/Euphemianos
*St Apollinaria/Dortheos
*St Athanasia of Antioch
*St Eugenia/Eugnios
*St Hilaria/Hilarion
*St Marina/Marinos
*St Marina (2)
*St Matrona/Babylas
*St. Pelagia/Pelagios
*St. Theodora/Theodorus
*St. Euphrosyne/Smaragdus
*St. Papula of Gaul
*St Thekla
*St Hildegonde of Neuss near Cologne
[all the above women dressed and lived as men, usually monks]
*St Uncumber [a bearded woman saint]
St. Sergius
and St. Bacchus
*St. Perpetua
and *St. Felicity
St. Sebastian
St. Augustine of Hippo 4thC
St. Aelred of Rievaulx early 12C
St. Anselm of Bec late 11C
St. Paulinus of Nola 4thC
and Ausonius
Baudri of Bourgeuil 1046-1130
Pope Benedict XI 1020-1055
Pope Boniface VIII b.c.1235-r.1294-1303
[charged with "sodomy" by Philip IV of France]
Pope Julius II
Pope Sixtus IV 1471-1484
[contemporary diarist calims he made his barber a cardinal, because he was his lover's son!]
Pope Julius III 1487-1555
and the Prevostino
Donatello 1386-1466
Pietro Aretino 1492-1556
Pomponia Leto 1428-1498
Niccolo Machiavelli 1469-1527
Andrea Poliziano 1454-1494
Leonardo da Vinci 1452-1519
(and Jacopa Saltarelli,
Andrea Salaini,
Francesco Melzi,
Cesare da Sesto,
Giuliano Boltraffio)
Raphael 1483-1520
Michelangelo Buonarroti 1475-1564
and Tommaso Cavalieri
Giovanni Antonio Bazzi "il Sodoma" 1477-1549
Giambattista Marino 1569-1625 [writer]
Caravaggio 1573-1610
Benevenuto Cellini 1500-1571
Tasso 16C [writer]
Niccolo Capasso 17C [Neapolitan dialect poet]
Antonio Rocco mid 17C [wrote and account of gay love
"L"Alcibiade Fanciullo a Scuola" in 1652]
*St Joan of Arc c.1412-1431
and *La Rousse
and *Catharine de La Rochelle
King Richard I the Lion-hearted b.1157-r.1189-1199
Nicholas Udel 1505-1556
Christopher Marlowe 1564-1593 [first creator of lists of Queers!]
?William Shakespeare 1564-1616
Richard Barn(e)field 1574-1627
Lord Southampton 16C
Earl of Oxford 16C
Charles Arundel 16C
Francis Bacon 1561-1626 [scientist]
Anthony Bacon 1558-1601
DH Lawrence 1885-1930 [writer]
T.E. Lawrence (of Arabia) 1888-1935 [writer and soldier]
Somerset Maugham 1874-1964
Virginia Woolf 1882-1941
Laurence Olivier
Florence Nightingale
Aleister Crowley
Marquis de Sade
Camille Saint-Saens 1835-1921[composer]
Jean Cocteau 1889-1963
Anais Nin 1903-1977
Tsar Alexander I 1777-1825
Nikolia Przhevalsky 1839-1888 [explorer]
Peter Tchaikosky
Sergei Rachmaninov 1873-1943[composer]
Mikhaill Kuzmin 1875-1936 [poet]
G.V. Chicherin 1872-1936 [politician]
Rudolph Nuryev 1938-1993
Alexander Hamilton 1755-1804
J. Edgar Hoover 1895-1972
Eleanor Roosevelt
Truman Capote 1924-1984
Walt Whitman 1819-1982
Henry David Thoreau 1817-1862
Raplh Waldo Emerson 1803-1882
Janis Joplin


and many many thousands more... look them up :mrgeen:

you are a good father who support your children if they confess that there are gay, but more than that you could help him to be heterosexuals, there are better lives and meaningful lives that we men needs to be enjoy, it is a life that we are designed to live, a life of heterosexuality, most filipino men like me didnt know how to enjoy it coz we never experience it coz our father is an absentee father whether they are far away or present in our homes

its good that you mention that some great leaders before are gay, this is a such good information, where did you get this?[br]Posted on: November 14, 2006, 11:19:15 AM_________________________________________________

isn't it morally wrong?

i dont bother whether this is morallly wrong or not coz it would be subjective, anyway, i try to resolve things here by knowing the root of the problem[br]Posted on: November 14, 2006, 11:23:09 AM_________________________________________________

i think its natural... homosexuals exist even in the animal kingdom...

i dont agree that humans are belong to animal kingdom or even the highest form in the animal kingdom

animals have no choice but only instincts, human has a choice, like homosexuality its a choice on meeting the unmeet needs but in a sinful way

[labyrinthbw]

@*dudes*

the factors i was talking about was discussed in one of our hi skul subjects (part man cguro to sa *** education) and that was eons ago ehehehe...

oh well, does it really matter? if the child wants to be gay, then let him be..

and for those straight men who refuse to talk about this, let them be... they might find this topic offensive...

you put a very heavy responsibility on the parents.. it's like the parents are partly blamed coz they weren't able to persuade the child not to be gay...
well, again, i'd like to stress that if the child opts to be gay, the parents will just have to support his decision.. and not try to stray him from being what he wants to be...

[*dudes*]

@*dudes*

the factors i was talking about was discussed in one of our hi skul subjects (part man cguro to sa *** education) and that was eons ago ehehehe...

oh well, does it really matter? if the child wants to be gay, then let him be..

and for those straight men who refuse to talk about this, let them be... they might find this topic offensive...

you put a very heavy responsibility on the parents.. it's like the parents are partly blamed coz they weren't able to persuade the child not to be gay...
well, again, i'd like to stress that if the child opts to be gay, the parents will just have to support his decision.. and not try to stray him from being what he wants to be...

Before the a boy or a girl choose to be a gay, there are factors tha twe need to consider why that person choose to be gay, one of the many factors is they are not comfortable with their same *** -- one of the reason is --- they have no healthy relationship with the same *** during their developmental stage

i suggest you will research about this especially child psychology and you will understand what im saying here.

as what i mention, i dont blame the parents or anybody, i juse emphasizing here the very importance of parenting coz parents has the greatest part of the development of the sexual being of a child

im not talking here about *** education but the love, support and affirmation of both father and the mother in nurturing their children to the person that they are suppose to be or in my terms "in their original design"

i just sense that while you are explaining or discussing your opinion here, that "homosexuality is a choice", yeah, you're right, but you know deep inside the hearts of a boy specifically, there is a deep yearning and desire to get belong especially with his fellow gender, from his father and his male friends, when that need is not meet, it become eroticized during his puberty stage, same *** attraction develops

i hate sometimes to hear when people says that this man is born to be gay

people dont usually understand and even experience what this so called "gay" has experience during his childhood years

this is the reason why, im always emphasize the importance of parents role in the lives of their children , most parents including mine is ignorant in the area of parenting, they might good provider but not a good parents coz parenting is not only limits to money but emotional and spiritual involvement of the parents to their children

i hope parents here could realize that