Porgatory

[WengIA]

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mao lagi ni hinungdan mga bai nganong dili jud dawat ning porgatory. buhat2x ra jdu ni daghan og lapses.. pero kahibaw mo ang akong gituohan kanang giingon nga sa sabakan ni abraham kana ra jud..ahihihih!

[noy]

i dont think bai noy ang catholic church gisunod nila ang jewish tradition daghan sukwahi ang catholic church sa tradition sa jewish man.. usa na ni wala may ingon ani ang tradition sa jews. di jud ko motuo ani bai noy' kay usa ni sa hinungdan ang catholic church why mostly sa Jews dili jud modawat ni Jesus Christ until now kay gimanipulate through doctrines nag maayo sa Catholic Church/Vatican ang Tradition og Culture sa mga apostles and early Christians. and it is very true daghan nay giusab tungod kay ang Vatican have their own traditions and culture nga gicounterpart nila.

wa koy mabuhat bai weng if mao nay tan-aw nimus CAtholic church and I really couldn't care less..so I'm just gonna leave it at that.

on the topic though, have you heard of the mourner's quaddish? it is a form of prayer in the Jewish tradition for God to hasten up the purification of the soul of a departed loved one...sounds familiar?

and Yes gi reject sa mga Jew si Jesus as the Messiah(manluluwas) kay taas kuno sya ug buhok..joke!because for them he just basically did not qualify as the prophesied messiah according to how they understood the messianic prophesies written in either the torah or in the kabbalah.. and not because of the catholic church oi...long before pa dunay na porma nga relihiyon tungod ni jesus..gi reject na sya sa mga hudeyo,,,mao bitaw nagbitay sya sa krus..

now going back to purgatory being based from jewish tradition, the first followers of Jesus and heck even Jesus himself was a JEW!!! so natural naay mga remnants from jewish tradition nga maapil sa bagong Abrahamic religion nga nibutho when Jesus started his ministry.

[noy]

insert ko boss ha ....

2 Maccabees 12:46: “Thus he made atonement for the dead that they might be freed from sin.” .. mao ni explanation sa Catholic about purgatory ..... sila ra nag himo ana nga word parihas anang Trinity wala mana nga word sa Bible ...

ang Debati ani kaning Maccabees kay dili mani part sa Bible accordingly but inserted in Catholic Bible ....

Ang Explanation aning Apocrypha ngano wala ni gi canonized sa Men of Great Assembly naa diha katong mga Prophets nga buhi pa like ni Malachi etc .... wala pa ang Vatican aning panahuna ...

wala gi apil na kay dili daw na Divine Inspired nga mga Book ...

sakto ka bai mao jud na ang usa sa mga main basis sa purgatory...
expound lang ko gamay if you don't mind
divine or not(referring to Maccabees books and the likes) it shows jewish tradition on prayers for the dead which can be confirmed through the jewish bible (dili apil ang Maccabees sa jewish bible though), kabbalah(sacred traditions) or even from extra biblical sources...meaning ginabuhat na na sa mga karaan ug sina unang kristyanos tungod kay kasagaran sa ila mga hudeyo.

ug kanang chesmes nga gi insert ras katoliko nang mga libroha can be refuted easily if we look at history..
in the 4th century mostly na compile na ang book considered to be divine inspired..nay mga main ug secondary..heck even the gospel of john kay gikadudahan paman gani na sa una...hahahaha and yes kanang Maccabees nga libro apil na sa deuterocanonical books meaning lesser canon.. but apil sa compilation regardless...
it was not until 1500 years have passed after the protestant reform mga nibutho ang kisaw nga gi insert daw na mga libroha..
gi unsa pag insert nga naa na gani daan? hehehehe even the orthodox biblical canon kay nag include ana...actually mas daghan pa ilang lista sa mga deuterocanon kay sa katoliko...basin gikuhaan ni Luther kay duna may conflict sa iyang sola fide ug sola scriptura...actually di man jud unta conflict pero kapuyan guro syag explain...mao ingun sya na hala! ipatangtang nalang na...hahaha

[noy]

ask lang ko ha daghan d.i sin mura trigo sincossin by the way s bible man gud sa magamay ug magdako sala is sala and confes to Jesus Christ no other people but through Him Jesus and ask his guidance to guid us day by day.....

bro pasensya kaau..wa ko kasabut sa imung question..

[noy]

mao lagi ni hinungdan mga bai nganong dili jud dawat ning porgatory. buhat2x ra jdu ni daghan og lapses.. pero kahibaw mo ang akong gituohan kanang giingon nga sa sabakan ni abraham kana ra jud..ahihihih!

basin sabakan ni Magdalena imung gipangita bai weng..

[Jhared]

the concept of limbo was never an official doctrine of the catholic church bai but a theological hypothesis instead given the condition of baptism being a requirement for salvation and the teaching about orginal sin. like the church's answer to the question whether or not a person who committed suicide would still see salvation, the fate of the person's soul is entrusted to god's mercy so does the souls of the unbaptized children. on a personal note, I don't believe such state exists.

You see that's the point, unbaptized children are believed to be presumably condemned, since the time of Aquinas this has been the doctrine, though not official however allowed by previous popes to be taught, that the church have been teaching. I think bag-o ra gi declare nga walay limbo i believe it was Benedict XVI who declared it, so for 800 years or more, this sort of questions have been bugging christians and inorder to fill the gaps some of you started making up concepts like purgatory and limbo to justify baptism..

[noy]

You see that's the point, unbaptized children are believed to be presumably condemned, since the time of Aquinas this has been the doctrine, though not official however allowed by previous popes to be taught, that the church have been teaching. I think bag-o ra gi declare nga walay limbo i believe it was Benedict XVI who declared it, so for 800 years or more, this sort of questions have been bugging christians and inorder to fill the gaps some of you started making up concepts like purgatory and limbo to justify baptism..

di man na condemned ang naa sa limbo bai, one of its names even kay paradise..yeah mga 2007 I think to gi official sa simbahan ang pag dismiss anang limbo nga theological hypothesis...specifically the limbo for infants.

[Jhared]

i dont think bai noy ang catholic church gisunod nila ang jewish tradition daghan sukwahi ang catholic church sa tradition sa jewish man.. usa na ni wala may ingon ani ang tradition sa jews. di jud ko motuo ani bai noy' kay usa ni sa hinungdan ang catholic church why mostly sa Jews dili jud modawat ni Jesus Christ until now kay gimanipulate through doctrines nag maayo sa Catholic Church/Vatican ang Tradition og Culture sa mga apostles and early Christians. and it is very true daghan nay giusab tungod kay ang Vatican have their own traditions and culture nga gicounterpart nila.

Judaism is the source of all this religious scuffle. And hebrew beliefs including hell and purgatory was sourced out from different mythical beliefs of the past (because Jewish land were held by numerous kingdoms ever since).. Jewish land was a melting pot ever since, even until now.. so too are their religious beliefs..

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di man na condemned ang naa sa limbo bai, one of it's names even kay paradise..yeah mga 2007 I think to gi official sa simbahan ang pag dismiss anang limbo nga theological hypothesis...specifically the limbo for infants.

When i say condemned im referring to the teachings of the past not of how it is being described now..

Whatever may be said about limbo today, the fact still remains that prior to the declaration Catholic Cathecism (specially in schools) have been teaching limbo, otherwise that phrase wont be coined as such now does it.. and the way i remember them explain it was nowhere near your description..

[noy]

When i say condemned im referring to the teachings of the past not of how it is being described now..

Whatever may be said about limbo today, the fact still remains that prior to the declaration Catholic Cathecism (specially in schools) have been teaching limbo, otherwise that phrase wont be coined as such now does it.. and the way i remember them explain it was nowhere near your description..

Pilay edad nimu bai? kay ever since nakasugat ko ug catechism class.murag grade 5 ko adto kay ang limbo place for unbaptized children who died before the age of reason. it's neither heaven or hell..hence called limbo...I'm turning 34 by the way..sahay gud bai lahi2x pang sulti sa catechism teachers, ubang pari mas unahon ilang interpretation kaysa unsay naka sulat dha sa actual teachings..mao gurong labad..even kanang limbo kay di man jud na official teaching yet some accept as such...the magisterium neither direct or forbid catholics to believe in limbo. I don't.

[Jhared]

Pilay edad nimu bai? kay ever since nakasugat ko ug catechism class.murag grade 5 ko adto kay ang limbo place for unbaptized children who died before the age of reason. it's neither heaven or hell..hence called limbo...I'm turning 34 by the way..sahay gud bai lahi2x pang sulti sa catechism teachers, ubang pari mas unahon ilang interpretation kaysa unsay naka sulat dha sa actual teachings..mao gurong labad..

Younger..

Because the importance of baptism is being overzealously emphasized in Cathecisms this results to the notion that the consequence of its absence is highly unfavorable even for babies, hence not paradise..