A Proposal: Proportional Solar System Scale Model (a la "Planetwalk" Cebu City)

[rodsky]

Backgrounder:

Most people actually have the wrong notion of the scale of the solar system in relation to the sizes of the planets. WHY? Simple. When you go to a library and find books and encyclopaedias with pictures of the solar system (or equivalently, you go to Google and search "Solar System") what do you find? You find this...







Now, surprising as it may be for most of you, but I'm sorry to tell you that these pictures are all wrong, in aspects pertaining to the size of the solar system and the planets, and the distances of the planets to one another in relation to their sizes.

Now here's another photo, published by the International Astronomical Union (IAU).



You might say "This should be correct, because the IAU published it!" Well, yes, in terms of planet/minor-planet proportions, the sizes of the bodies are accurate. However there's still one problem--the distances. So how far is the sun, really, from the earth? From Mercury? From Jupiter? To know this, we must construct a true, proportional solar system, based on a fixed determined size of the Sun, and from there, work out the size of the planets, and the distances between them.

A great example of this is seen in this video...
YouTube - Bill Nye Demonstrates Distance Between Planets

What I'm proposing, therefore, to amateur astronomy buffs out there (as an activity that could be part of the International Year of Astronomy 2009 celebrations), is to create a temporary, "to-scale" "proportional solar system" here in Cebu City, and my venues of choice for this activity are the following:

a) Fuente Circle
b) USC Talamban Football field
c) (other suggestions welcome)

Basically, the activity involves this:
1) Determining the size of the model Sun - this is very important, because the distances will be based on this...or...
2) Determining that the distance say, from the center of Fuente, to the edge of the Fuente fence, is the distance to Neptune. Once this distance is determined, we can then set the proportional size of the Sun and of course, the rest of the planets/minor planets
3) Modeling the Sun and planets out of clay, wood, paper or whatever materials are cheap but visually appealing and suitable for the purpose.

I think this activity will make the general public truly understand how BIG the solar system really is, and how TINY the planets are compared to the distances between the planets and the sun.

I also think this activity will be of interest to:
a) Science teachers
b) Modelers, sculptors, artists, graphic designers
c) parents
d) amateur astronomers

so I think it's a worthwhile IYA 2009 Cebu activity.

Share your thoughts and ideas about this proposal in this thread.

-RODION

[AMD_fan]

that would be exciting... hehehe...

[rodsky]

I just realized the difficulty of finding a good place here in Cebu for this endeavor. I mean, based on Bill Nye's demo, even if we shrunk the sun to about 1/4 of a meter (250 cm diameter ball), then we still need about 1 kilometer of space, to show the distance from the Sun to Pluto! So if we shrink the solar system down to the size of Fuente, it seems almost microscopic na dyud ang size sa planets. Not a very good prospect for a public presentation.

I wish you can throw in more ideas.

-RODION

[poldopunk]

scale down the distance between the planets proportionally? add lang ug label para sa correct distance. basically, duha imong gi scale, ang size sa planet ug ang distance between them.

[handsoff241]

Suggestions:
Since this is avery informative and interesting activity, why not ask the government for help and use the space in SRP?

Also, an elevated viewing platform would be nice so that audience can fully see and contrast in real time the real sizes of the planets.

I'm not a big fan rodsky, but for the sake of science, Good luck a very splendid idea!

And also, this part:

Quote: What I'm proposing, therefore, to amateur astronomy buffs out there

potential aid-givers might say, "im not an astro buff, why care?" suggestion lang.

[rodsky]

SRP sounds good. Thanks for the suggestion. However, is it accessible to the general public? The point of the activity is to allow the general public to really see what the solar system looks like, correctly proportioned, and not like how it's depicted in books. Thank you for all the input. I shall rework this idea as soon as I get more time.

@handsoff, they might not personally care, but I do think that if they have any children, they would care what sort of science education their schools are giving them, and this is one opportunity to showcase something rarely seen by kids and adults alike.

-RODION

[moz_k2]

Just wanna share something.

Back in my elementary days our school have a solar system scale model.
Naa sa among library, on the ceiling by the way.
Nya ang tunga nya kay ang naa dako nga suga, pwede pud nimo ma on, representing the sun.
The planets are made of spherical styrofoam and painted, Jupiter is as big as a basketball ball I think.
Naa pud to cya electric motor pra pwede revolve ang planets around the son.
The scaling may not be accurate but it is a great way to educate the young minds.
And the background have a drawing of constellations.
The ganahan nko ato kay ig hangad nimo kay it seems like you're in outer space looking at our solar system.
Ambot kaha karon naa paba to, I remember back then nga permi to nila ayohon ang electric motor.
.............................................

I suggest the scaling of the size and distance be separate.
Just put a label unsa ang scaling size, same thing for the distance.

[rodsky]

Quote: Originally Posted by moz_k2 Just wanna share something. Back in my elementary days our school have a solar system scale model. Naa sa among library, on the ceiling by the way. Nya ang tunga nya kay ang naa dako nga suga, pwede pud nimo ma on, representing the sun. The planets are made of spherical styrofoam and painted, Jupiter is as big as a basketball ball I think. Naa pud to cya electric motor pra pwede revolve ang planets around the son. The scaling may not be accurate but it is a great way to educate the young minds. And the background have a drawing of constellations. The ganahan nko ato kay ig hangad nimo kay it seems like you're in outer space looking at our solar system. Ambot kaha karon naa paba to, I remember back then nga permi to nila ayohon ang electric motor. ............................................. I suggest the scaling of the size and distance be separate. Just put a label unsa ang scaling size, same thing for the distance.

What you just mentioned is a device called an orrery. Unfortunately, it's that very device that has caused a lot of problems regarding children's understanding of the real size of the solar system (along with those encyclopaedia illustrations I've mentioned and posted). Which is why it's pointless to separate size and distance--to truly comprehend the TRUE size of the solar system, one must illustrate BOTH in ONE setting.

-RODION

[handsoff241]

@rodsky, I understand; for the sake of science and information, I strongly agree with you.

SRP can be accessible to the public, if Tomas wants it. I can't think of any better place for your idea to be conceived considering of the huge area it will cover, and don't forget the viewing platform.

[rodsky]

Quote: Originally Posted by handsoff241 @rodsky, I understand; for the sake of science and information, I strongly agree with you. SRP can be accessible to the public, if Tomas wants it. I can't think of any better place for your idea to be conceived considering of the huge area it will cover, and don't forget the viewing platform.

The viewing platform is nice but not necessary, primarily because, if you are standing on the platform and looking down at the HUGE solar system, dili nimo makit-an ang mga planeta sa sobra niani ka-gamay. Ang sun ra siguro ug Jupiter ang maklaro (I doubt that even Jupiter can be seen clearly). Remember that, in a 4-kilometer stretch of highway, Jupiter was only the size of a tennis ball! Now how do you spot a tennis ball from say, 2 kilometers away Now imagine, if we reduce the size of the solar system to just 1 kilometer in radius, then that tennis ball (Jupiter) should be shrunk to the size of a ping-pong ball...still very tiny if your viewing platform is 500 meters away.

So mas importante for the people to walk from the Sun, and then to the different planets, to appreciate the massive amounts of distances between them, based on their proportional sizes. This is why it's called a "planetwalk".

-RODION

[handsoff241]

binoculars... heard of them?

i was actually putting those ideas in consideration.. or we can use the tallest hotel in cebu hahahah

[rodsky]

Quote: Originally Posted by handsoff241 binoculars... heard of them?

Yes, I own a pair.

Quote: Originally Posted by handsoff241 binoculars... heard of them? i was actually putting those ideas in consideration.. or we can use the tallest hotel in cebu hahahah

If you're going to use a pair of binos to view them, why not just point your binos at the REAL sky and view the REAL planets with them? After all, you'll be seeing the same (tiny) things, and at least, sa real nga sky, you can actually see them as points of light...sa scale model, mas lisod i-locate ang model planet, because mongos ra or smaller ang sizes nila (very difficult to spot a mongo seed from 500 meters away in broad daylight using a pair of binoculars). Another plus of actually using your binocs to view the planets is, you can actually say to someone that you've spotted Venus, Mars, Jupiter, or Saturn using a pair of binocs (a 20x80 on a tripod will have the ability to spot Uranus, and Neptune. Even good medium-priced telescopes will have difficulty in seeing Pluto, so binocs, no matter the degree of magnifying power, are out of the question).

Again, the main point of the activity is appreciation of the real sizes of the planets and the real distances of the planets as seen in a to-scale model of the solar system, and the best way to appreciate this size is to do the planetwalk. If you want to use Crown Regency, the whole idea will be missing its point--because then, after spotting the model planets with your binoculars (or spotting scope,or what have you), you'd have to go all the way down the hotel elevator, and walk the planetwalk anyways, and it's just adding another potential annoying to-do to the activity (basin kapuyon ang mga gustong mag-experience sa activity, saka'g pana-og sa taas kaayo nga hotel).

-RODION

[diehard96]

nindot ni nga idea. dapat lang i-consider:
1. location - permit, security etc
2. fundings

[handsoff241]

Lisud jud diay ni.... dili pwede ang viewing platform.


I have a wild idea.. why not stretch the whole model across Cebu?

Plot the whole solar system model across whole Cebu, put the planets(model) in top of buildings and put signage on them indicating that this is planet Mars and explain where is the sun located and why it is this far. Then when they look up they can see a replica of the planet, then they will get the message of the idea...

if Mars is in SM and the sun is in Crown regency and Mars looks this small... so on and so forth.

I know it's wild, but also the impact of public exposure for awareness is brilliant!

Advantages:

*You can ask the building owners as sponsor when their building is in the spot of plotted planet location.

*Media coverage, it might even get national attention!

*People will go to Carcar and see a replica of Pluto in there while knowing that the sun is in crown regency, an easier comparison due to familiar knowledge.

Disavantages:
*samok, you will talk to a lot of people

*maintainance, you need to maintain the models

*the sun and jupiter will be hard to maintain

*plotting takes time.

[Hellblazer 2.1]

a virtual planetarium/museum na lang. saves space pa.