What matters the most when hiring a programmer?

[silent-kill]

Quote: Originally Posted by simoncpu Bill Gates is a thief. He stole ideas from Xerox, Apple, and other companies. He didn't even made MS-DOS. He just bought 86-DOS at a cheap price, monopolized the industry by riding on IBM, and the rest is history... He's just a shrewed businessman... [ simon.cpu ]

dam n bill gates is 3vil and an opportunist like every other businessman out there.... but his f*cking rich man... we can't do no sh*t bout that lol

if this was an MMORPG bill gates a beta player who uses haxx to pwnd th n00bs ahah

[cebugdev]

Diploma proves that you went thru shit and survives, without diploma is like taking a shortcut and believing 'someday i will become that bill guy from microsoft'.
In real world, you dont expect to become a programmer for life.. someday the company will promote you to become leader/manager and will test your tolerance sa pressure. Even junior or senior engineers maka feel pressure specially when you are developing an ACTUAL product to be release on the market (You had to have quality and beat the deadline else sales oppurtunity is lost).

In business, investors think primarily of their investments, programmers as asset, If I am to offer to a client that i can do this kind of software i will present some things to support my claim, eventually client will ask for the background of all stakeholders involved - Project Managers, Project leaders, Engineers, Testers, And ofcourse i will give the best feedback/bacground to the client to get the contract. Presenting something that will generate doubt to client will endanger the deal.

Imagine if client is a Japanese firm, and project is a firmware for a cellphone... Japanese are strict on requirements and quality.

[softtouch]

Quote: Originally Posted by simoncpu Bill Gates is a thief. He stole ideas from Xerox, Apple, and other companies. He didn't even made MS-DOS. He just bought 86-DOS at a cheap price, monopolized the industry by riding on IBM, and the rest is history... He's just a shrewed businessman... [ simon.cpu ]

And then? Whats wrong with that? I would do the same when I could make some billions of dollars...
What you use at home? Windows? Yes? So you are using the software of a thief... hm...

[moz_k2]

Try to give the applicants technical exam.
Let them solve the problem in any language they want...
With time limit of course pra pressure..

Nka agi ko ani sa una..hehehe

[silent-kill]

Quote: Originally Posted by cebugdev Diploma proves that you went thru shit and survives, without diploma is like taking a shortcut and believing 'someday i will become that bill guy from microsoft'. In real world, you dont expect to become a programmer for life.. someday the company will promote you to become leader/manager and will test your tolerance sa pressure. Even junior or senior engineers maka feel pressure specially when you are developing an ACTUAL product to be release on the market (You had to have quality and beat the deadline else sales oppurtunity is lost). In business, investors think primarily of their investments, programmers as asset, If I am to offer to a client that i can do this kind of software i will present some things to support my claim, eventually client will ask for the background of all stakeholders involved - Project Managers, Project leaders, Engineers, Testers, And ofcourse i will give the best feedback/bacground to the client to get the contract. Presenting something that will generate doubt to client will endanger the deal. Imagine if client is a Japanese firm, and project is a firmware for a cellphone... Japanese are strict on requirements and quality.

you got a point there bro,.. you cant freelance your way to big companies. competition is tough, specially on the higher ranks. you'll need that extra edge.. a degree or a master's degree to get promoted or at least show the potential to fit the job

[simoncpu]

Quote: Originally Posted by softtouch_ph And then? Whats wrong with that? I would do the same when I could make some billions of dollars... What you use at home? Windows? Yes? So you are using the software of a thief... hm...

I use FreeBSD and Linux. My laptop runs Mac OS X. This is out of topic, but it sure is funny when someone makes incorrect assumptions...

[softtouch]

Quote: Originally Posted by simoncpu I use FreeBSD and Linux. My laptop runs Mac OS X. This is out of topic, but it sure is funny when someone makes incorrect assumptions...

Good for you. I just don't understand why you are attacking Microsoft in this topic, which has not much to do with Microsoft.

[simoncpu]

Quote: Originally Posted by cebugdev Diploma proves that you went thru shit and survives, without diploma is like taking a shortcut and believing 'someday i will become that bill guy from microsoft'. In real world, you dont expect to become a programmer for life.. someday the company will promote you to become leader/manager and will test your tolerance sa pressure. Even junior or senior engineers maka feel pressure specially when you are developing an ACTUAL product to be release on the market (You had to have quality and beat the deadline else sales oppurtunity is lost). In business, investors think primarily of their investments, programmers as asset, If I am to offer to a client that i can do this kind of software i will present some things to support my claim, eventually client will ask for the background of all stakeholders involved - Project Managers, Project leaders, Engineers, Testers, And ofcourse i will give the best feedback/bacground to the client to get the contract. Presenting something that will generate doubt to client will endanger the deal. Imagine if client is a Japanese firm, and project is a firmware for a cellphone... Japanese are strict on requirements and quality.

Diploma doesn't really prove anything. I worked on a "firmware" too but... but... I need to stop writing because this is a public forum.

All I can say is that diploma doesn't prove anything... Cge lang ta storya dire sa forum. Show me the code.

[simoncpu]

Quote: Originally Posted by softtouch_ph Good for you. I just don't understand why you are attacking Microsoft in this topic, which has not much to do with Microsoft.

Wala lang... it wasn't my intention to attack anyone. I was just typing my thoughts and nothing more. Peace.

[javapenguin]

Thread becomes interesting when it's out of topic, hehehe. I use Linux and it's the preferred platform in my workplace. Some companies like programmers who are comfortable using Linux and especially open source softwares.

[manick]

OT nice thread for aspiring programmers like me

[dlanyer77]

Let me return the topic. Hehehe!

Attitude, passion and quality fanatics. Those were my criteria. Not all but some graduates I encountered were only good in something that is less significant to what I expected. To become a good programmer you don’t need a diploma. All you need is your heart. Most companies take less attention with diploma instead they are more focused to number of years exposure because they don’t risk their organization to become a training ground for newbies. Eventually, newbies aren’t productive unless you had a super fantastic manager who did the entire job for them. A meticulous company who struggles for profit in a short period of time will never allow a child to be part of the game.

So start coding now!

[pikapika2501]

I still prefer college graduate. Hindi naman sa descriminasyon but I did think and was trying to digest all opinions that I had read.

But the reason why I prefer college grad kasi eh dahil corporate world ang papasukan eh dapat may corporate attitude, corporate skill etc...

Hindi naman sa nangangahulugang pag wala kang tinapos eh wala ka na. Pero come to think of it, diba pag mahal mo ang ibon mo eh bibili ka nang magandang kulungan. Magandang kapares(asawa) at masasarap na meals(bird feeds) para sa kanya. Lahat ng arte e ilalagay mo diba.

So, ang attitude ko kasi eh dahil mahal ko ang work ko. Monthly e naiinspire akong bumili ng damet (mga 400php sana isa [syempre tipid] pero kung walang budget e save muna).... bali gusto ko yung pinopormahan ko yung trabaho ko at gusto kong gwapo ako sa loob nun. Syempre pa, gusto ko rin yung gwapo ang trabaho ko (overall this matters).

Syempre kung gwapo ka na at gwapo ang trabaho mo. Syempre makikita nung boss mo at ng mga colleagues mo na isa kang magandang modelo. At kung may mga clients eh maiisip nilang maganda kang e-harap sa mga yun.

So, kung pansinin nating mabuti eh ang opportunity eh open sayo. Wag nating hayaang mawala ang kahit onting part ng opportunity natin. Dapat ang pinapagwapo natin eh ang career natin. This involves getting a college degree.

Pero sa mga hindi pa graduate eh talagang sipag at tiyaga. Kasi hindi rin naman ako nadaliang makatapos eh. Pero kung madali sa inyo eh pinagpala na kayo talaga. (tutoo nyan eh hindi lahat ng mahal ko sa buhay eh tapos na. pati narin aking mga kaibigan na close sakin. Pero sobrang simple namin at inaaspire naming lahat na makaGraduate. So far eh ang utol ko na lang na isa ang hindi nakakagraduate. isang taon ang agwat nya sakin. kaya ito't nag iipon ako dahil isang subject na lang sya at hindi pa na-ooffer yung subject. ipon mode muna ako).

(nga pala if you want to read some of my post from other forum about how I became a programmer. Try visiting this link sa espiya.net its:
http://www.espiya.net/forum/index.ph...4058.msg458235 )
hindi yan ganun ka updated pero 2006 ko pa ata pinost yan. Pero nakakatuwa lang kasi nung nabasa ko ulit. wala pa'kong updates about this month... malaki rin kasi nangyari sa life ko this month about my programming career.

Nga pala. tama talaga sinabi nila. Programming is not about the being good. It is all about passion (thats my opinion).

[bigeasy]

Based on my working experience... not generalizing here.

Worked with a guy who had no degree. Good programmer. Bad attitude. Had a chip on his shoulder about not having a degree. Seemed very suspicious and defensive toward me and most people who had degrees. I really wanted to like the guy but he was hard to work with, kindof a solo artist. No teamwork.

Best programmer i worked with. Very articulate, Very confident, not the most technical person. Didn't care what programming language he used. His thing was, 'tell me the problem, i will fix it'. Had a good sense of humor too, especially when we screwed up.

Best programmer I hired was a young kid who had a 2-year degree. His experience was kinda scattered, not really focused on one technology. During the interview, i asked him what his job function will be. He could have said something about writing great programs in so-and-so language in this-and-that platform. Instead, he said... 'to make the jobs of the users as easy as possible'. I knew i would hire him after he said that.

What matters to me when hiring a programmer?
Skills are important but skills can be learned.
I think it's all about attitude.